Quick question here. Can you outwit a Superman Enemy's outwit? I know you can't outwit team abilities, but the PAC says that if two Superman Enemies are adjacent, the one with the higher point value "gains outwit". It's worded like it grants a power rather than duplicating one like the Batman Team ability and stealth.
The same question could be asked about the CSA TA as well, although it states that they "have" prob control rather than "gaining" it.
Sorry if this has been asked before. Thanks for the help.

Yes you can.

Superman Enemy and CSA specifically state that they GIVE the character outwit or prob control. Treat it as if they had it on their dials. The only difference is that they can have muliple powers in the same slot this way.

Sorry, but I don't think you can, they are team abilities! No matter what the rules say specifically.

it also says that it only lasts until the end of their turn so there'd be nothing there to outwit on your turn

Let's read the rules:

Check the seconded bolded Goodman. You gain the power, as if it appeared on your dial.

Now let's examine Outwit.


So, you gain the power, as if it were on your dial, and someone outwits it, so you pretend it isn't even on the dial.

They are not Outwitting the TA, they are Outwitting the power granted by the TA. Just like Outwitting the Toughness granted by Force Field (you can't Outwit feats, either), the fact that a power is granted is all that matters.

Now TAs (and feats) that grant power-like abilities are a different story; they're is nothing to Outwit in the case of the Batman TA, for example. It has an effect very much like Stealth, but it doesn't actually grant Stealth and so can't be Outwitted.

Ok, say that I have three Superman Enemies. A B & C, A is highest point total Be is next C is Least.

A is next to B. A Outwits. B makes an attack, we'll say either HSS Charge or RS. At the end of of the action Outwit is gone.

But now B is next to C. B Outwits. C makes an attack, we'll say either HSS Charge or RS. At the end of of the action Outwit is gone.

Now C is next to A.

Can A use Outwit again?

As near as I can tell, yes!

As the people have said already. This is an OLD OLD question.

Yes you can outwit the outwit gained by the Superman Enemy TA.

No.
Outwit specifically states that a character may only use it once per turn.

D'oh! You're right.


It's just not my day.....

Gumpold is right about mr cranberry's question.

While Gumpold is correct that OW can only be used once per turn, there is a bigger problem with your scenario. From the SE TA description, the TA is cancelled (on both figures) when the figure pair (that resulted in the higher point figure gaining OW) are not adjacent at the end of an action;
Therefore, in your example, when B uses RS, HSS or Charge to attack and, at the end of the action, the figures are no longer adjacent, A loses OW because its TA is cancelled. (While adjacnecy is also a factor, if a second friendly SE figure, D, was still adjacent to A and was also less points than A, A would still lose OW if you declared that A gained OW as a result of being adjacent to B who is no longer adjacent at the end of the action.) If B moved adjacent to another SE figure C during this action, neither figure gains OW because B's TA is also cancelled (because it broke adjacnecy with A). So neither A nor B could gain or grant OW again for the remainder of the turn. The TA would become active again at the begining of your opponents turn, but you wouldn't be able to use the OW granted by any adjacencies until the begining of your next turn.

Just to clarify something about this, while its true that the OW granted by the SE TA can be countered by an opposing figure's OW, there is a way around that. If you are using OW offensively, to counter defensive powers on figures you are attacking, its probably not providing you with any benefits during your opponent's turn, so when they declare they are OWing your figure's OW, you can cancel your TA for the turn. Once the TA is cancelled the figure no longer has OW (unless it has it naturally like Braniac ) and there is no OW to counter:
Of course, this makes the action illegal and allows them to chose another power to OW, but sometimes its more important to retain your OW for your turn and there may not be any other power for them to OW that would hurt your team more. This is not quite as effective when using OW defensively (to counter offensive powers like HSS and RCE) since the countered power would return as soon as you cancel the figures TA, but since it will come back once they counter your OW anyway, the only question is whether there is some other power you'd rather they didn't counter more.

BoT

Ok this I don't get. Why would you think that B couldn't gain OW by being adjacent to C after the action? If A, B & C were all adjacent to start then A & B would both gain OW as they met the requirements of the TA.

But this example I had layed out is a common one that newbies usually try to use, so I figured I'd bring it up and try to answer Fortron's question. Or at the very least anticipate a later one.

The reason it doesn't work is in the TA, "This team ability is cancelled at the end of an action in which the two Superman Enemy team members are no longer adjacent." Which is to say, figure B can't use its TA for the remainder of the turn after the action it breaks adjacency with A. So when it completes the action that caused it to become adjacent to C its TA is cancelled and neither figure can benefit from the use of B's TA to gain OW, because its cancelled.

Does that clear it up?

BoT
BoT