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Ok this Judge is really begining to annoy me because he has a completely different understanding of the rules compared to any where else I play.
My friend was playing one of the regular guys and he simply stated his defense was value X ( I don't remember the exact number) because of ICWO +1 & Energy Shield Deflection +2 for a total of +3 to modifying his defense. Which clearly falls under the rule of 3 as I understand it. However the guy was taking a ranged shot that passed through hindering which is applyed after replacement values its not a modifier. The judge ruled that he could not recieve the terrain bonous as it was limited due to the rule of 3. But the rule of 3 as I understand does not affect replacement values. Please correct me if I am wrong here but every where else I play rules the opposite of this judge who in my opinion doesn't know the rules very well.
Another thing this judge ruled against me one this very weekend was. Ghost Widow (Widow does not have armor piercing) is adjacent to my Joker & Lockjaw. Ghost Widow poisons Joker & Lockjaw. Joker Masterminds dmg to Lockjaw. Lockjaw has toughness so Lockjaw reduces off the 1 dmg delete to him for poison and he also reduces off the 1 dmg Masterminded to him? Judge said that he would take 1 dmg because he recieved 2 dmg. But the 2 dmg as I see it wasn't dealt at the same time it dealt from 2 different figures. Maybe I am wrong in both cases and if that if correct than the other 3 venues I play at are wrong all the time on the above 2 questions.
This is the same Judge that didn't take the time to learn back in July that the wild card copying had been changed that once the figure with the team ability you are copying is gone you instantly loose it. He rules against me on that once and then the next time I came in he was like umm you were right about the wildcard thing. I was like I know.
Ok this Judge is really begining to annoy me because he has a completely different understanding of the rules compared to any where else I play.
My friend was playing one of the regular guys and he simply stated his defense was value X ( I don't remember the exact number) because of ICWO +1 & Energy Shield Deflection +2 for a total of +3 to modifying his defense. Which clearly falls under the rule of 3 as I understand it. However the guy was taking a ranged shot that passed through hindering which is applyed after replacement values its not a modifier. The judge ruled that he could not recieve the terrain bonous as it was limited due to the rule of 3. But the rule of 3 as I understand does not affect replacement values. Please correct me if I am wrong here but every where else I play rules the opposite of this judge who in my opinion doesn't know the rules very well.
You are incorrect. From the Danger Room rule book (page 32):
If a line of fire between two characters on the same elevation crosses the boundary line of hindering terrain, increase the target’s defense value by 1 for the attack after applying any replacement values. This is called the hindering terrain modifier. Add this modifier only once, regardless of the number of squares of hindering terrain the line of fire passes through.
As you can see, hindering terrain is a modifier (just like ICWO and ES/D), not a replacement value. Thus, it could not increase the bonus to DV past the +3 bonus the character already had.
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Another thing this judge ruled against me one this very weekend was. Ghost Widow (Widow does not have armor piercing) is adjacent to my Joker & Lockjaw. Ghost Widow poisons Joker & Lockjaw. Joker Masterminds dmg to Lockjaw. Lockjaw has toughness so Lockjaw reduces off the 1 dmg delete to him for poison and he also reduces off the 1 dmg Masterminded to him? Judge said that he would take 1 dmg because he recieved 2 dmg. But the 2 dmg as I see it wasn't dealt at the same time it dealt from 2 different figures. Maybe I am wrong in both cases and if that if correct than the other 3 venues I play at are wrong all the time on the above 2 questions.
It is dealt at the same time. From the PAC:
POISON (OPTIONAL): Once at the beginning of your turn, as a free action this character deals 1 damage to each opposing character adjacent to it.
So we see here that all the damage from a Poison character is the result of a single action and is thus dealt simultaneously. Also:
MASTERMIND (OPTIONAL): Each time this character would be dealt damage, you may instead choose to have all the damage be dealt to a single adjacent friendly character with a lower point value than this character. If the damage resulted from an attack with knockback, the character that takes the damage is knocked back. If a character is KOd by damage dealt using this power, it is considered to have been KOd by the character that originally dealt the damage. Damage dealt by this power is not an attack.
Here, MM points out that the damage is simply dealt to another character. No mention is made of "after the action is resolved" or "after resolving other effects", etc.
Thus, Lockjaw was dealt 2 clicks (1 from being adjacent to a Poison character + 1 from the MM), and his Toughness reduced it down to 1. Same thing can happen with EE and EE splash damage.
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This is the same Judge that didn't take the time to learn back in July that the wild card copying had been changed that once the figure with the team ability you are copying is gone you instantly loose it. He rules against me on that once and then the next time I came in he was like umm you were right about the wildcard thing. I was like I know.
Thanks in advance for all responses.
Later on, Joe
He made some mistakes, sounded like he owned up to it later. It happens; no one is perfect. At least you got an apology... most people aren't that big about admitting when they are wrong.
My friend was playing one of the regular guys and he simply stated his defense was value X ( I don't remember the exact number) because of ICWO +1 & Energy Shield Deflection +2 for a total of +3 to modifying his defense. Which clearly falls under the rule of 3 as I understand it. However the guy was taking a ranged shot that passed through hindering which is applyed after replacement values its not a modifier. The judge ruled that he could not recieve the terrain bonous as it was limited due to the rule of 3. But the rule of 3 as I understand does not affect replacement values. Please correct me if I am wrong here but every where else I play rules the opposite of this judge who in my opinion doesn't know the rules very well.
I'm not 100% sure on this one, but the basic rule is pretty simple: If it involves a plus or a minus, it's a modifier. If it involves a set number, it is a replacement.
That said, as I understand it the Rule of 3 prevents values from being modified by more than 3 points in either direction. In other words, you cannot get any value more than 3 points over what's printed on the dial. In this case it would be a total of +4, which would be capped at +3 due to the rule of three. That's how I'd rule it, but I'm not certain it is the correct way to do it.
Quote : Originally Posted by Bornhelm
Another thing this judge ruled against me one this very weekend was. Ghost Widow (Widow does not have armor piercing) is adjacent to my Joker & Lockjaw. Ghost Widow poisons Joker & Lockjaw. Joker Masterminds dmg to Lockjaw. Lockjaw has toughness so Lockjaw reduces off the 1 dmg delete to him for poison and he also reduces off the 1 dmg Masterminded to him? Judge said that he would take 1 dmg because he recieved 2 dmg. But the 2 dmg as I see it wasn't dealt at the same time it dealt from 2 different figures. Maybe I am wrong in both cases and if that if correct than the other 3 venues I play at are wrong all the time on the above 2 questions.
Here, the judge was wrong. All Poison damage (from a single fig) is resolved simultaneously, so Lockjaw would indeed be dealt 2 points of damage due to Joker's Mastermind, which would then be reduced by Lockjaw's Toughness to 1.
Quote : Originally Posted by Bornhelm
This is the same Judge that didn't take the time to learn back in July that the wild card copying had been changed that once the figure with the team ability you are copying is gone you instantly loose it. He rules against me on that once and then the next time I came in he was like umm you were right about the wildcard thing. I was like I know.
Well, the Judge's word is law. It's as simple as that. The best way to be prepared for it is to know where to find the evidence that he was wrong in a timely fashion and point it out to him. If you can't, accept the ruling and point it out to him afterwards - as long as he can admit he was wrong it's not a huge problem. Everyone is wrong sometimes.