Rampaging Hulk - a crazy power creep rant - Page 13

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Rampaging Hulk - a crazy power creep rant

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10/19/2007, 21:13

#181

Vegeta1

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Quote : Originally Posted by Crow

Compare to E She-Hulk, from Supernova, who has the FF TA but otherwise none of the feature you mention, and costs exactly one point less than this Hulk. Just look at the two. I challenge you to justify how on earth these two figures cost the same thing, when Hulk excels on her in every single category by not just a little, but a lot. She-Hulk's only claim: her FF TA, and opening Charge instead of Squash. Hardly enough to make up the difference in any serious way.

Until recently, I was an adamant believer that Seth was simply finding better ways to organize his dials to maximize efficiency based on the point formula. Now with all the new powers emerging, there's just no way he's doing anything but underselling these Special Powers at a serious discount to make the new figures more powerful...

Co-signed.

10/19/2007, 21:25

#182

Vegeta1

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Quote : Originally Posted by StormX

..Because you were using Avengers Namor so much up until Rampaging Hulk was announced?

You seem to be taking these awful figures no one would ever use, and using them as your measuring stick, and it's not really showing Hulk as being "undercosted", simply that bricks have been handled poorly, and weren't playable until recently, and Rampaging Hulk is simple a good example of them finally being playable.

"Them"?

The only "them" (Bricks) that are playable are Hulk and...Hulk (Green Scar).

I highly doubt other future Bricks will get the same treatment.

10/19/2007, 21:33

#183

Vegeta1

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Quote : Originally Posted by StormX

Actually I'm trying to say he is out of the ordinary, but just not for the reasons you suggest.

You're saying he's the new poster child for power creep.

I'm saying he's the poster child for a class of figures that have largely been unplayable finally becoming playable.

The difference? Your view seems to suggest he's too good for his cost, I'm suggesting he's finally making bricks worth their points, as opposed to being overcosted in the past.

Don't you mean "brick" singular? (only the Hulk has this V.I.P. treatment)

It remain to be seen if Seth gives other future bricks this same consideration.

10/20/2007, 15:59

#184

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Quote : Originally Posted by Crow

Ok, I don't normally go off on a rant... I think the last time I did so was when I was concerned that Protected was too much for too little (a view I still hold, and that I think is vindicated by most tourney winning teams since then).

For 128 Points, this Rampaging Hulk figure "concerns me". I mean, I love the design, don't get me wrong - this is a Hulk in all his terrible fury and I love it. But when I look at what 128 points could normally buy me in a close-combat piece, and then I look at this new Hulk, I have to say - not much can compete.

I wish they had made this great new piece at the point value it deserved, which obviously bottoms out at around 160-170, and could easily have been higher.

Just to recap, this is how much damage he can do, even assuming he never touches an object: 5/5/6/6/6/6/6/4/4/5
His defenses contain not one, or two, but FOUR instances of 18.
His attacks are "respectable", and one can argue that his opening "9" is his only real drawback.
He has four clicks with some mobility function front-loaded.

Does anybody feel his point cost is actually on the money for this kind of thing? Let's look at other grounded bricks in the vicinity of his point cost: we've got E Juggernaut, from FF, at 140... he doesn't even come close except in the defense department. There's Piledriver who is... just worse. Hmm, we've got Namor from Avengers (that's not too far back), with his itty-bitty Flurry and CCE that doesn't even come close. I could pay 170 for a shiny new She-Hulk who can only manage 5 damage on two of her clicks.

I think Seth is a great designer - his dials are fun and well thought out. So why do his point-cost assignments sometimes feel like a blind person playing darts?

He has to get into base contact with the figure before he can do any of that Damage, how does that make him 'too powerful'? Most rangers can just stay away and avoid him, taking pot shots at him.

Actually, if he uses his 'Squash' power, and he L/C right into the centre of a group of 8 figures, he can do *gasp* 16 Damage on his first click, assuming no Damage Reducers.

But wait, for 83 points, plus 10 points for Nova Blast (that's a measly 93 points) Rookie Emerald Empress can Running Shot into a group of 48 figures, and do 4 unavoidable damage to all of them. (192 points of Damage)

Both unlikely scenarios, but hey, just illustrating a point about how much more effective Range figures can be, for less points, than any brick. Let's not mention figures like V Havok, V Blackfire etc

Anyway, it's not like he's the be all end all. He's just actually playable. I, for one, hope that more brick type figures get this kind of treatment in the future.

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