You are currently viewing HCRealms.com, The Premier HeroClix Community, as a Guest. If you would like to participate in the community, please Register to join the discussion!
If you are having problems registering to an account, feel free to Contact Us.
But again the power specifically states as you copied and pasted it; Friendly characters can use free actions instead of power actions to make a relic roll.
What can means in that statement is that you have a choice to instead use the free action vs. the power action. Like you said; "It does not say, Friendly characters MUST use free actions...", but it does not say you can use both either
If that power was intended to work the way you or other people think it should work then the word instead should have been replaced with and, as well or, in addition too.
This is simple grammar people! Chrisdosmil is cool and all but I'm sorry I don't buy his ruling on this. If he truly ruled this specific power to be worded this way then he needs to brush up on his grammatical skills. This is one of the few powers written correctly with common sense use of adverbs and verbs that is learned in a 7th grade grammar class.
But you know folks, as ignorant as Wizkids and NECCA has been with their inept ability to construct a coherent 7th grade sentence for a power to say what they want it to mean, I can totally understand them screwing this one up too...
Are you so impressed with the oranges authority that you give respect and credence to all that claim it? Do you read everything you’re supposed to read? Do you think every thing you’re supposed to think? Buy what you’re told to want? Let's think on our own folks and use common sense facts to formulate our own conclusions.
"I'LL FORGE YOUR WEAPON, YOU $#@*&%: Friendly characters can use free actions instead of power actions to make a relic roll and modify their roll by +1 if not already modified by this effect."
It does not say "Friendly characters MUST use free actions..." or "relic rolls by friendly characters are now free actions..." etc. There's an element of choice there.
Actually, it does say "must". To read that you just have to understand the language of HeroClix. Here's a snippet from the 2013 rulebook to explain:
When a power or ability indicates that the character “may” do something, that indicates an option that the player of that character can make when the situation presents itself. Other than that, powers and abilities are not optional. A special power that says “Character can use Blades/Claws/Fangs and Stealth” does not allow the character to choose whether or not it is using Stealth (since that standard power’s description does not use the word “may”) but does allow the character to choose when it will roll a d6 for its close combat attack (since the description of that standard power does use the word “may”).
Splitlip's power does not say "may" in it, so it is not optional. This means that it turns every relic roll into a free action. It is not possible to make a power action relic roll when Splitlip is on your team.
Actually, it does say "must". To read that you just have to understand the language of HeroClix. Here's a snippet from the 2013 rulebook to explain:
When a power or ability indicates that the character “may” do something, that indicates an option that the player of that character can make when the situation presents itself. Other than that, powers and abilities are not optional. A special power that says “Character can use Blades/Claws/Fangs and Stealth” does not allow the character to choose whether or not it is using Stealth (since that standard power’s description does not use the word “may”) but does allow the character to choose when it will roll a d6 for its close combat attack (since the description of that standard power does use the word “may”).
Splitlip's power does not say "may" in it, so it is not optional. This means that it turns every relic roll into a free action. It is not possible to make a power action relic roll when Splitlip is on your team.
Fair enough.
Rule dispute settled without having to resort to being snarky and sarcastic. Thank you.
But you know folks, as ignorant as Wizkids and NECCA has been with their inept ability to construct a coherent 7th grade sentence for a power to say what they intended it, I can totally understand them screwing this one up too...
The irony of misspelling the name of the company in the middle of this rant is spectacular.
Quote : Originally Posted by Magnito
In other words, it's all Vlad's fault.
Quote : Originally Posted by Masenko
Though I'm pretty sure if we ever meet rl, you get a free junk shot on me.
Quote : Originally Posted by Thrumble Funk
Vlad is neither good nor evil. He is simply Legal.
But again the power specifically states as you copied and pasted it; Friendly characters can use free actions instead of power actions to make a relic roll.
What can means in that statement is that you have a choice to instead use the free action vs. the power action. Like you said; "It does not say, Friendly characters MUST use free actions...", but it does not say you can use both either
If that power was intended to work the way you or other people think it should work then the word instead should have been replaced with and, as well or, in addition too.
This is simple grammar people! Chrisdosmil is cool and all, but I'm sorry I don't buy his ruling on this. This is a game that is based on the wordings of powers/abilities. These powers/abilities are written in the English language; therefore, grammar must be taken into account when analyzing these powers/abilities.
This power is worded clear as day how it is supposed to work per the English language. If Chisdosmil seriously ruled this way when interpreting this power, then he needs to brush up on his grammatical skills. This is one of the few powers written correctly with common sense use of adverbs and verbs that is learned in a 7th grade grammar class. Again I don't think that link was in the context of Splitlips power though...
But you know folks, as ignorant as Wizkids and NECCA has been with their inept ability to construct a coherent 7th grade sentence for a power to say what they intended it mean; I can totally understand them screwing this one up too...
Are you so impressed with the oranges authority that you give respect and credence to all that claim it? Do you read everything you’re supposed to read? Do you think every thing you’re supposed to think? Buy what you’re told to want? Let's think on our own folks and use common sense facts to formulate our own conclusions.
You've been a member since 2008 and you're trying to use the "English" argument? Hahahahahahahah! Son, this is HEROCLIX, not English. Remember, if you CAN punch yourself in the nuts, Heroclix says you MUST punch yourself in the nuts.
Having said that, I agree with this:
Quote : Originally Posted by VanisherPunisher
Actually, it does say "must". To read that you just have to understand the language of HeroClix. Here's a snippet from the 2013 rulebook to explain:
When a power or ability indicates that the character “may” do something, that indicates an option that the player of that character can make when the situation presents itself. Other than that, powers and abilities are not optional. A special power that says “Character can use Blades/Claws/Fangs and Stealth” does not allow the character to choose whether or not it is using Stealth (since that standard power’s description does not use the word “may”) but does allow the character to choose when it will roll a d6 for its close combat attack (since the description of that standard power does use the word “may”).
Splitlip's power does not say "may" in it, so it is not optional. This means that it turns every relic roll into a free action. It is not possible to make a power action relic roll when Splitlip is on your team.
But until/unless someone overturns that quote from Chrisdosmil, you can do both I guess.
Splitlip certainly is a charmed dwarf, every single ruling he's had so far has made him better.
Quote : Originally Posted by Typhon
what members contribute through donations is actually costing us money
I am going to go ahead and re-enforce the ruling that was given.
I have sent this up to determine if that is a scenario that Game Design wants with the new rules change.
Quote : Originally Posted by Necromagus
When I came on board as RA I brought with me a mission to meet the intent of a power/ability and a firm distaste for exploits or loopholes that circumvented the intention of a rule. That's where the Rules team comes in.
The irony of misspelling the name of the company in the middle of this rant is spectacular.
Damn right, shows just how much respect I have for a company that is pumping out quantity rather than quality. If they have, so little respect for their fan bases and the amount of time it takes to put together a grammar school sentence. Then I can care less how their name is spelled...
"Nearly all men can handle adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power."-- Abraham Lincoln
"We buy things we don't need, with money we don't have, to impress people we don't like..."
You've been a member since 2008 and you're trying to use the "English" argument? Hahahahahahahah! Son, this is HEROCLIX, not English. Remember, if you CAN punch yourself in the nuts, Heroclix says you MUST punch yourself in the nuts.
Actually son, I've been a member since 2002. I had to change my username because I stopped playing after Legacy and came back during Supernova. During that time (I Graduated high school, was living on my own and working two jobs while attending college.) Remembering my username and password for a site that I did not play a game for anymore was not on my priority list.
But if you want to have a E-peen contest to see who's is bigger. I do like your measly 43 iTrader to my 235 iTrader... (I honestly don't care what someone's iTrader is, but for the sake of acting like you, who cares about my; "join date"??? Then I will gloat about it.
Last edited by BigBlueBeast1982; 03/12/2014 at 15:43..
"Nearly all men can handle adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power."-- Abraham Lincoln
"We buy things we don't need, with money we don't have, to impress people we don't like..."
Actually son, I've been a member since 2002. I had to change my username because I stopped playing after Legacy and came back during Supernova. During that time (I Graduated high school, was living on my own and working two jobs while attending college.) Remembering my username and password for as site that I did not play a game for anymore was not on my priority list.
:: PSST :: I think he was agreeing with you, in a roundabout way.
Longest-Reigning Drunken HeroClix Champion - anyone got a liver?
Storm is in a teacup? Was she made really, really tiny, and is at risk of drowning in some Earl Grey? Or is it a giant teacup, like some sort of Arcade-spawned Murderworld deathtrap?
Either way, I would love a Murderworld teacup deathtrap.
Quote : Originally Posted by dairoka
I'm pretty sure Dragon has the Future keyword and Probability Control.
Quote : Originally Posted by Dragon
With the amount of times you are Ninja'd I swear you must have the Past Keyword
Storm is in a teacup? Was she made really, really tiny, and is at risk of drowning in some Earl Grey? Or is it a giant teacup, like some sort of Arcade-spawned Murderworld deathtrap?
Either way, I would love a Murderworld teacup deathtrap.
As a Relic, a Resource or as a Vehicle?
Quote : Originally Posted by Harpua
red king is spot on with this statement.
Quote : Originally Posted by dairoka
listen to Red King.
Quote : Originally Posted by YouWaShock
At the risk of going OT, I need to point out that it appears red king is talking to himself.
Actually, it does say "must". To read that you just have to understand the language of HeroClix. Here's a snippet from the 2013 rulebook to explain:
When a power or ability indicates that the character “may” do something, that indicates an option that the player of that character can make when the situation presents itself. Other than that, powers and abilities are not optional. A special power that says “Character can use Blades/Claws/Fangs and Stealth” does not allow the character to choose whether or not it is using Stealth (since that standard power’s description does not use the word “may”) but does allow the character to choose when it will roll a d6 for its close combat attack (since the description of that standard power does use the word “may”).
Splitlip's power does not say "may" in it, so it is not optional. This means that it turns every relic roll into a free action. It is not possible to make a power action relic roll when Splitlip is on your team.
Onto a serious conversation with member who has some couth. I want to point out two things. I understand Heroclix language sometimes contradicts the English language. For instance like you're saying, "Can" means always in Heroclix. In the real-world "Can" means; To be able to, to have the ability, or permission to do something. It does not mean that you "MUST" do it.
The use of "can" as a "must" in Heroclix is ignorant. I'm sorry, but like I said earlier, this is a game based off of powers and abilities that are written in sentences that are constructed from the English language. Therefore, they should follow the same rules as the English language, much as we follow numeric based values in the game that are based off the laws of math/arithmetic.
We don't go around giving a the number 3 the numeric value of the number 5 do we? No. Then why are we substituting words that don't need to be substituted. Just write the sentence correctly with the right choice of words in the first place. Problem solved!
If they really want a power to be used at all times, then it needs to be worded with "MUST". It's just that simple. Don't convolute the power/ability with the word "can" as a substitute for the word "must", when anyone with a 4th grade education knows the difference between "can" and "must" (Or at least I hope they do..)
The kicker here, is that the dictionary actually list "Can" as a synonym for "May". Those two words are actually what's interchangeable. NOT "Can" and "Must"! Sorry Heroclix you epically fail at 4th grade level for grammar skills.
"Nearly all men can handle adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power."-- Abraham Lincoln
"We buy things we don't need, with money we don't have, to impress people we don't like..."
I am going to go ahead and re-enforce the ruling that was given.
I have sent this up to determine if that is a scenario that Game Design wants with the new rules change.
I'm not kidding when I ask this, but can you re-enforce better and proper grammar skills when wording powers and abilities. If Heroclix used words with their proper meanings, and correct grammatical syntax, then we would not be having this argument or many other for that matter.
"Nearly all men can handle adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power."-- Abraham Lincoln
"We buy things we don't need, with money we don't have, to impress people we don't like..."