What's the rest of the army?

Kudos Engineer!

I think you'll get more offers for your challenge than I got for mine, but it pleases me no end to see someone willing to stand up and demonstrate, for those incapable of conceptualizing the problem.

Best of luck in getting offers, I doubt you'll need much luck in the game (beyond not rolling below a 5 on the first two attacks).

Take care,

Rick

If you never play against it, you will never learn how to beat it. You should thank your opponent for playing an army of cheeze. You're only as good a player as the competition in your area. Actually, I rarely play anything other than republic or laio faction pure so I've honestly never used one and probably never will.

yay \o/

a horay for teh germans :)



On topic: nope, wizkids is to blame 100% for the pile of *********************************** they call rules.

@Enineer: You speak of a faction pure SS army with Arrow IV against an other faction-pure army with mechs?

Because if you don't, you just mentioned one big reason why most cheese armies are REALLY cheesy.

And for the players being responsible why there are cheese units because they use them, I'd like to give you a scenario to think about:

Daimler-Chrysler brings a new car to the market which they did not test drive before release. Either that or they didn't read the testing reports or simply ignored them.

So now the car is released, and guess what happens. There is a car accident with it, and three people are killed. Now the surviving forth person takes Daimler-Chrysler to the court because of the obviously mis-designed car.

What do you think: will the court send the accusing person away with the explanation that he/she just should not have used the car, then there would not have been the accident? That Daimler-Chrysler is innocent in this matter? Think about it.

SS-Arrow IV Tanks can be beaten quite easily, all you need are 2 DF-Mjolnirs, a few DF-Scout ATVs and a Maxim loaded with 3 DF-Kanazuchi BAs. I tried this several times at my venue and it worked. And, by the way, during the last 5 months nobody in my group played a SS-Balac!

@Mythrael

That would be an army especially designed to counter artillery.
Have we really come this far that every army we create MUST be anti-artillery, or else we loose?

And what about other factions that don't have Scout ATVs or Kanazuchis? Do I have to mix factions even if I don't want to, and use BR or DF pieces if I want to win?

The main point here is that any normal, balanced army will be shred to pieces by such an uber-artillery army. And soon we'll have only two army templates. You'll have the guys fielding the artillery, and you'll have the guys fielding the anti-ari pieces. And this saddens me.

Nowbody says that an Arrow IV is unbeatable. But you cannot deny that a normal balanced army with one mech, one maybe one artilllery, one AA unit and a transport will have a hard time playing against 3+ SS Arrow IV. And it frightens me that the A-IV could enter the game without being noticed as obviously broken.

And that Wizkid$ won't do anything about it for quite a good while, you can clearly read in the chat transcript. They still think that right now, there is no problem with tank drop, artillery and charge.

ENGINEER's SS Arrow IV army:

3 SS Arrow IV
2 SW J-37's (I've been thinking about switching to 2 merc Zahn's, the base defense is much better and repair is just not used often. The reactive armor is nice on the SW J-37)
6 DF peasants
7 DF ATV's
1 HL peasant
2 SH Galleons
4 SH ATV's

bring four pieces of the figure "8" hindering terrian. Place any water on your opponents side of the board (your army does not need water).

On the far left of your deployment zone set up the Arrow IV (angle it in to the right), place the J-37 next to it on the right side. Use 3 DF Peasants in a formation to cover the left side. Mirror this formation on the right side, but place the other HL peasent to block off front shots on your Arrow IV.

In the middle place the last Arrow IV and a SH Galleon on either side. Place the 4 SH ATV's in formation with the Galleons protecting the front of the Arrow IV.

The 7 DF ATV's get infiltrated. If your opponent allows, place them in base contact with their units. Generally have 1 formation of 3 and 4 singles.

To defeat this army you must cross the board safely, and get under the 8" minimum.

Surviving the first turn.
No Arrow can be based the first turn. Any charging first turn mechs can be pogged for 2 or 4 damage.

Would a picture help, or can you imagine the setup?

With the current rules this army has not lost. I once did loose VC3 against a BH army with 8 DF ATV's and 1 LI ATV. I now leave 2 enemy infantry units alive until I also kill their mech.

Athos

I'm not sure where you got the faction pure idea. I don't like to handicap myself with any one factions shortcommings.

My comments about Germans being difficult opponents. I generally don't like sterotypes, but when every German I've meet is good at board games (or gardening) I begin to wonder.

David Wilson

I have also been searching for an army to beat this one. I think the army would have a mech with evade (for the first few clicks). Range combat of about 8" is enough.

The game I only won VC 1 and VC 2, my opponent salvaged the far right Arrow IV, then stood inbetween the other two Arrow's (under the min of both). I now put higher priority on basing my opponents mechs with infantry than shooting at them.

Engineer.

Never said I'd beat you... but I do want to play vs a 3 or 4 SS arrow 4 army. If I can make it to origins (I live out west, but my wife owes me a weekend trip anywhere in the country by myself) I might be able to make it. Depends on when events start on Friday, and how late they run on Sunday.

Just an aside, it is a companies fault if they produce overpowered units/cards/whatever for a collectible game. Don't use them? At least competitive players will always use the most effective units, and you can't blame them. It can get boring, but that is the way it is. Rotation doesn't help either.

At least Wizards takes the effort to restrict or ban cards that are overpowered for restricted play. That would work so much better imo. Restrict some arty to one. Ban other units if necessary. I would rather that 100 times moreso than retiring sets.

Even in Magic where there are more selections for cards than there will be units once the rotation is in full swing, you have many decks that are identical. The most powerful cards are used, and those are played. I was playing MODO the other night, and kept facing one affinity deck after another. It is all anyone plays who wants to win all their games. Because they made new powerful cards. And people will play those most powerful cards. Many won't.. but those will be the people losing. :)

I have some good decks, but I lost many games to affinity the other night.. I refuse to bow to the cheese. But many players will not. They will play those every game. Some people just never want to lose, even if it means playing the same boring deck you see 8 out of 10 games endlessly.

Which is why rotation is a *really* bad idea. If they are not going to restrict or ban units, *and* they make rotation so few sets, you are going to see a LOT of repetition, and a lot of cheese. Might as well get used to the idea. Play it or lose. ;)

fleabitfox

Make everyone play faction pure. I guarantee that will fix most of the problems and it is so much more fun to play.

Arnis will charge your car!

Engineer:
I would love to play a "Kill and Keep" game with you at GenCon.