You are currently viewing HCRealms.com, The Premier HeroClix Community, as a Guest. If you would like to participate in the community, please Register to join the discussion!
If you are having problems registering to an account, feel free to Contact Us.
I don't follow. If Sin could somehow use MoE, then it would have no impact on this power... MoE only starts mattering when there are two tokens on the character. But once she has those two tokens, she could be given a non-free action per the MoE description; this power still wouldn't matter.
Right I agree but if you say tokens are irrelevant then anything pertaining to tokens no longer pertains to them meaning this power would be usable but that's just semantics and is irrelevant.
Quote : Originally Posted by normalview
And regular non-free actions normally require one token... which can't be given, either. MoE specifically says that they character using the TA can be given a non-free action if it has two tokens. Double power actions are non-free actions.
So MoE characters should just be allowed to use a power every turn when that power is designed specifically to be used once every two turns at most.
Is this how it's intended to work or should maybe that be looked into deeper?
Quote : Originally Posted by from the Players Guide
MASTERS OF EVIL
When a character using the Masters of Evil team
ability has two action tokens on it, it can still be given
a non-free action. If you do, deal it one unavoidable
damage after the action resolves. At the end of your
turn, do not remove action tokens from a character
that used this team ability this turn.
Notice nothing is said about not giving action tokens.
The Rulebook reads
Quote
4) THE RULE OF ACTION TOKENS
No game effect can result in more than 2 action
tokens on a character. If part of a game effect
would cause this to happen, that part of the game
effect is ignored.
Therefore when an MoE character has two action tokens any effect allowing him to be given a non-free action (such as the MoE TA) should be ignored.
As it's written right now the MoE TA is completely useless.
Notice nothing is said about not giving action tokens.
The Rulebook reads
Therefore when an MoE character has two action tokens any effect allowing him to be given a non-free action (such as the MoE TA) should be ignored.
As it's written right now the MoE TA is completely useless.
Really?
Don't you understand every power/TA/Ability/trait breaks the "standard rules"?
Otherwise we wouldn't have willpower because the rules say when you take a second action token it causes pushing damage. Oh and invulnerability no longer works because the basic rules say when you take damage to click your dial x# of times.
Just stop it already, please.
Quebbster - "'Generic' has no official definition. Ask your judge."
Is this how it's intended to work or should maybe that be looked into deeper?
From earlier in this very thread:
Quote : Originally Posted by normalview
Why is this not thought all the way through? Only a very small handfull of characters can even take double power actions... and of those, none of them can use MoE normally. They all rely on Cypher or some other trick to get access to the TA.
And even then, unless you've also got a Baron Zemo on the map, they'll take a click of damage for using the TA even if they normally wouldn't take pushing damage from having the two tokens applied under normal Double Power action circumstances.
Sounds to me like if you really want to pull this off, you are going to have to have a lot of conditions align just so. And if you want to go to that much trouble, more power to you
Or, more plainly, yes that is the way it is meant to work.
Quote : Originally Posted by gmastermcd
Furthermore the MoE TA reads
Notice nothing is said about not giving action tokens.
The Rulebook reads
Therefore when an MoE character has two action tokens any effect allowing him to be given a non-free action (such as the MoE TA) should be ignored.
As it's written right now the MoE TA is completely useless.
Nope. The TA says you can give a character a non-free action when it normally can't be given actions. Assigning tokens is byproduct of taking an action. That golden rule of action says that you ignore the part that would cause more the two tokens to be placed... so you ignore the placement of the tokens from assigning the non-free action.
Don't you understand every power/TA/Ability/trait breaks the "standard rules"?
Otherwise we wouldn't have willpower because the rules say when you take a second action token it causes pushing damage. Oh and invulnerability no longer works because the basic rules say when you take damage to click your dial x# of times.
Just stop it already, please.
Powers/TA/Abilities/Traits are all game effects if something says no game effect can cause something to happen then no game effect can cause that to happen.
Powers/TA/Abilities/Traits are all game effects if something says no game effect can cause something to happen then no game effect can cause that to happen.
Masters of Evil doesn't add any additional tokens, it simply allows you to still take actions even if the character normally could not. Hell, you're not even adding another token for doing the free action (since you can't), you're taking an unavoidable damage and are unable to remove the existing tokens instead of the normal consequence of adding an action token.
Forum Team Building Contest #2 and #3 Winner, & runner up for #1 and #4.
Or, more plainly, yes that is the way it is meant to work.
Nope. The TA says you can give a character a non-free action when it normally can't be given actions. Assigning tokens is byproduct of taking an action. That golden rule of action says that you ignore the part that would cause more the two tokens to be placed... so you ignore the placement of the tokens from assigning the non-free action.
Or, more plainly, MoE works just fine.
OK I am not trying to be rude or anything but I am always teaching new people to play and I hate telling them a rule works the way it does "because I said so". Since you are saying that rule isn't ignoring an action being given it is instead ignoring an action token being placed then where in the rulebook does it say a character can't be given a non-free action when they already have two action tokens? I thought that was the rule preventing a third non-free action being given.
Disregard this post as I have found where it is stated. Thank you Normalview for helping me understand exactly how it worked.
Masters of Evil doesn't add any additional tokens, it simply allows you to still take actions even if the character normally could not. Hell, you're not even adding another token for doing the free action (since you can't), you're taking an unavoidable damage and are unable to remove the existing tokens instead of the normal consequence of adding an action token.
Masters Of Evil doesn't give a free action. Maters of Evil would give a token if not for the rule I posted therefore your post about TA's breaking standard rules is completely mute. I am sorry if you are upset that you were forced to read what I posted and if it upset you. Thank you for all the courtesy you showed posting even though I offended you so.
Masters Of Evil doesn't give a free action. Maters of Evil would give a token if not for the rule I posted therefore your post about TA's breaking standard rules is completely mute. I am sorry if you are upset that you were forced to read what I posted and if it upset you. Thank you for all the courtesy you showed posting even though I offended you so.
Offended who? Haha, I was just stating facts, sir.
Forum Team Building Contest #2 and #3 Winner, & runner up for #1 and #4.
Masters Of Evil doesn't give a free action. Maters of Evil would give a token if not for the rule I posted therefore your post about TA's breaking standard rules is completely mute. I am sorry if you are upset that you were forced to read what I posted and if it upset you. Thank you for all the courtesy you showed posting even though I offended you so.
Reading the second half of this, I can only surmise that you replied to the wrong post and poster.
Quote : Originally Posted by DemonRS
Justify to me why this thread is necessary and I'll keep it open..
Quote : Originally Posted by Girathon
It pissed me off all weekend rorschachparadox wasn't dead.
Why is this not thought all the way through? Only a very small handfull of characters can even take double power actions... and of those, none of them can use MoE normally. They all rely on Cypher or some other trick to get access to the TA.
And even then, unless you've also got a Baron Zemo on the map, they'll take a click of damage for using the TA even if they normally wouldn't take pushing damage from having the two tokens applied under normal Double Power action circumstances.
Sounds to me like if you really want to pull this off, you are going to have to have a lot of conditions align just so. And if you want to go to that much trouble, more power to you
13 figures have a DPA, of those, two can use it and not take a click of pushing damage unless something takes away the Indom (Tartarus) or Quintessens TA (Imperiex).
Black Adam or Aquaman could also use the Mercenary feat (Hmmm, 100 point Black Adam, Baron Zemo, Mercenary and Inspiring Command...)
Why is this not thought all the way through? Only a very small handfull of characters can even take double power actions... and of those, none of them can use MoE normally. They all rely on Cypher or some other trick to get access to the TA.
And even then, unless you've also got a Baron Zemo on the map, they'll take a click of damage for using the TA even if they normally wouldn't take pushing damage from having the two tokens applied under normal Double Power action circumstances.
Sounds to me like if you really want to pull this off, you are going to have to have a lot of conditions align just so. And if you want to go to that much trouble, more power to you
More will come There will be wildcards and MOE's with this one day.
When they first introduced transporters they had the : symbol and yet it was like 3 years before they actually had a character that had it