I can sympathize with that notion, at least. That is how I have felt about the last 7 years of Avengers comics.

For what it is worth, I have plenty of faith that Morrison can make this a stellar, enjoyable, and memorable comic book. The current Batman mythos is not a mess, but a great stage for telling great stories. Final Crisis, despite its flaws, was a great story. RIP was the best Batman story I think I have ever read.

The only thing that causes me any hesitation about Bruce Wayne's return is that it means my time, as a reader, with the Grayson/Damien team is coming to an end. Those comics have been as fun and exciting in very noteworthy way.

Crisis and RIP were a load of poo. As long as Morrison is running the Bat-ship I will continue to move my way over to Marvel where they have way better writing. I was all for Dick taking over the mantle of the bat, the way they got there was brutal.

Obviously to each his own, but I also thought Final Crisis was great (I actually just re-read the Hardcover last night). Superman Beyond, is definitely some of Morrison's best stuff. The panel where he's reaching out to the reader and listening to you breathe is still great even without the 3D effect. At the time I did annotations for the last issue because some people were having difficulty following it (http://www.hcrealms.com/forum/showpo...&postcount=164). Basically you have to understand that Final Crisis is about narrative being introduced to the Universe and The Final Crisis of the Monitors is about that narrative breaking down. Therefore the last issue parallels that by having its narrative splinter. It really was quite an impressive story and very rewarding if you stick with it.

^But, because of all you've stated above, it doesn't mean anything. It simply jumps back and forth from existential navel-gazing to frenetic, frantic fenzy in the blank space between panels. It's choppier than the theatrical cut of Daredevil and has less impact on comics than Eelektra did on film.

Nobody cares about the "Final Crisis of the Monitors," at least not over the characters we've invested in for years. The finale of the so-called "Final Crisis" is nothing more than Morrisson's "gotcha" to his readers, and the entire saga boils down to simply his own egocentric acid trip in print.

[quote=Tim Drake;4465124Nobody cares about the "Final Crisis of the Monitors," at least not over the characters we've invested in for years. The finale of the so-called "Final Crisis" is nothing more than Morrisson's "gotcha" to his readers, and the entire saga boils down to simply his own egocentric acid trip in print.[/QUOTE]

By the sound of your post you, I would have to assume that you rate comic book stories on their overall impact on continuity.

Consider the possibility that there are other ways in which to judge a comic. I do so by their enjoyability as a story. That doesn't have to carry weight across titles. It only has to carry weight within its own pages. Final Crisis did that.

Nope, I don't. But a summer event crossover touted to be "the one that changes everything" or something to that effect, and especially a DC Crisis title, is supposed to have impact. Final Crisis does not. In fact, it's such a mess that aside from Bruce's death, most of the rest of it is being ignored.

That is most definitely arguable. Enjoyment aside -- you enjoyed it, I didn't, and nothing will/should change that -- I would posit that it did not carry much weight, even within its own pages, because a) it spent far too much of its time in an existential nightmare that only makes sense to Grant Morrisson, and b) when it came down to it, everything about the characters we know and care about played last fiddle next to the Monitors.

The only parts of Final Crisis that were worthwhile for me were Legion of Three Worlds, Rage of the Red Lanterns (which really had nothing to do with FC at all), and parts of Revelations.

I hate morrison, he should never be put on main line books. Look at the sketches, nobody cares about loin cloth wearing bat-caveman.

It's Morrison's attempt at paying homage to some of the weird 1950's Batman stories.
I'm not saying it's a good idea, I'm just saying that's what he seems to be going for.

That, and weirdness in general, seems to be all Morrison's been going for since he started writing Batman...

1. All event comics tend to get touted in such a manner. I always tune that stuff out, so I never paid any attention to how it was advertised.

2. Does a DC "Crisis" really have to change everything? I say no. I say that a DC title could use the word Crisis without having to be anything other than a story with a beginning and an end.

3. Impact: Bruce Wayne is dead (or so the DCU believes), the Bat-titles and that entire corner of the DCU has been reshaped. The New Gods are gone. J'onn J'onzz is dead. That is impact. The DCU hasn't ignored any of that. That is quite central to a lot of the stories they have been publishing since then. Did you want more impact? If you really didn't like the story, I don't get why you keep harping on it for not having enough impact. You almost sound like you wanted it to be talked about ad nauseum in every title DC writes.

hopefully it's revealed that he's been Vandal Savage the whole time.

that would rule.

Excuse me, but can you edit your thread's title to include the word SPOILER? TIA

What if Bruce came back, but concentrated on rebuilding the Bruce Wayne persona after Hush had his grubby little hands all over it. He'll need to pull his nuts out of the fire and rebuild his company.

I don't know I have liked his work before. Yes I said it.

His writing is just like every one else. Some of their work you like or you don't. EVERY writer will say they have a good run on a book or a bad run. Maybe you do not like what he did on Batman but enjoyed something else he did. Or not at all.

To me he does something I could never do. I am not a publisized writer/author, I wish I was. I think I have the mind set to come up with some wild stuff to put down on paper, but I don't have the commitment to write a whole book. Maybe...maybe I might be able to do a short story of a few pages or something.

Now I also like Geoff Johns, but there is some of his stuff I think is horrible. His run on Teen Titans bored the snot out of me. But I still like his stuff over all. His Lantern stories have been great.

So you may not like Morrisons work or not, he is still one of the go to writers for weird and off the wall stuff. Like him or hate him he will still be around.

Unless he goes the way of Rob Liefield, which if he ever does any more work, he should have his fingers chopped off.

Crisis On Infinite Earths, Infinite Crisis, and Final Crisis are supposed to act like a "trilogy" of sorts. Can you tell me how Final Crisis is a worthy follow-up to the previous two? The only connections are highly superficial.

No, it doesn't have to change everything, and I was using that phrase as an example. Identity Crisis wasn't nearly so grandiose a story as Final Crisis, but it still resonated, and had infinitely more depth.

Most of the groundwork for Bruce's death was laid before Final Crisis, and having Batman RIP amount to nothing more than a year-long teaser for about three pages of Final Crisis was nothing but cheap marketing at its worst.

As for the New Gods... they're dead. So what? It's barely been touched upon since, and what was supposed to lend it gravity beforehand failed to do so. If Morrison hadn't kept everyone in the dark and/or changing his mind, Countdown and Death of the New Gods might actually have added something worthwhile to that whole mess and made me feel something for the New Gods in Final Crisis. As it was, they were just annoying to me, taking the focus that should have been on the main characters of the DCU.

And as for J'onn, like most of the "momentous" events of Final Crisis, his death was treated as less than a footnote, when it should have been one of the centerpieces. Major events for the main characters got sidelined (at best) in favor of Morrison's "Fifth World" characters and the Monitors.

No, you're missing my point. The DCU titles have picked up on what they should have. My problem is that those events - the deaths of J'onn and Bruce, Barry's return, the whole Mary Marvel mess, etc - were sidelines and footnotes, when they should have been the main story. By focusing on new characters no one cares about the main story of Final Crisis, in and of itself, is inconsequential, and easily (and best) forgotten.