I guess it takes a pure Wolf player to see that Kyle Wolf is the perfect backup for Sadia...have him stand behind her, and if something threatens her, rush it. Hard to go wrong for, what, 84 points?
Actually, pretty much everything in that huge list has a use...I will agree with the VV1 Rangers, including Cesar, and probably the SC SM1, but that is all.
The SW Crimson Hawk is a monstrosity. Grapple and Agility lets you more or less control anything on the battlefield with a melee attack.
Hauberks, as mentioned earlier, are great backup units. How would you like a Behemoth II tank with an attack bumped to 14?
Firestarters are cheap ways to threaten 'Mechs with clicks of heat. Someone said that only new players would ever 'let' a Firestarter base one of their units. One, I always thought that was the choice of the one controlling the 'Mech, and two, that proves my point. You do take time to worry about it, which hinders your strategy.
Once again, people need to realize that ballistic weapons are not the Spirit Cats forte. Susan Drummond is a godsend to us in some situations. Not only does she do more than 2 ballistic damage, but 21 point defense is a bit rude. People already get angry when SC Kage armors live through two-turn poundings...but what if you suddenly could not even hit them?
Most of the 'Mechs listed have a melee attack...does that mean people think 'Mechs that are most effective in base contact are poor units? Alright. Keep thinking that when the flamers and hand-to-hand weapons start going.
I would keep ranting, but it has already been done here.

Mash vehicles are the most worthless. First off, they do no damage, so when repairing a unit (only one infantry) you have to roll to see how many clicks to repair. I researched all the repairable units (speed mode foot) in the game prior to Counterassault and found that the majority can only be "healed" 2 clicks. With the new 450 point/3 orders (one too few in my opinion) you've just used 1 order to repair a unit 2 clicks. Now your opponent can use 1 order and do 2 or more clicks of damage to your unit.
The units that can be "healed" the most are peasants, DF Gnome BA and Banson Raider infantry (of course these can be only healed 3 or 4 at the most).

email me if you want to see the excel file for yourself. I'll update it with CA soon.

[email protected]

@ Koshiro

Was not saying that those units were useless, just that they are not what is considered to be top-of-the-line combat units in today's game. Yes, they all have a use and I have fielded some of them myself from time to time. However, by and large, they are considered to be of lesser value in combat than many others which regularly see play.

No ffense is intended toward anyone's favorite units, but the guy who started the thread asked for a list of what I call the "bottom-feeders" or some people call "dust collectors" or "box fillers". Those units which rarely see play even though they might be perfectly viable units in SOME situations, whatever the reaosn, their stats or heat or whatever make them too limited for the quickly changing battlefields most of us fight on today.

Chris

Highlander :^: Ghost
Any of the Condor tanks from the original DA set...

You've obviously never seen what SS Sprints can do. After playing a fellow SS player I built up lot of respet for them. I now rate them as better than SS Balac when used offensively.

I am not even going to comment on your dissing of all SW/HL stuff.

Cheers

James

What is with you people!!!
Pyro isnt a bad mech at all.
Either are firestarters.
SC combat engineers have good use
and some of the other units too.

over critical is what I call it. lighten up. The DF firestarter and pyro are worthy mechs.

highlander leggionaire

I got something to say to you ppl about the highlander ghost. I love it. It's a great thing for hunting artillery. It's got a forgiving heat dial and charges for 6 damage. Once in melee it does 5 damage. That and it's stats are pretty constant, it has a great front arch.

The other thing is, I had two H ghosts and they were charged by 4 BR Legos in the first round. Guess how many did damage. One. That's it, that's all, only one hit. Despite their infantry-grade attack they are excellent. A great piece for finishing off some smart allec-LE, or an artillery.

You people gotta realize that in exchange for defense, we got two weaknesses: Slow speed, and bad attack. But, really, we can afford to miss. ^_^ we got all the time in the world.

Ambulances. Ugh... Who the heck wants to waste orders healing infantry when you can just bring Liao and have fanatics?

Plus, Behemoths are horrid. I played a guy who ended up pulling two behemoths recently in a sealed booster and I had ATV's. He didn't get a single shot off. I felt bad for him, even though it was funny to make motorcycle noises as my ATV's just based him time and time again.

There's a lot of ragging on the Sprint here, which strikes me as quite foolish. Sure, most can't shoot up a target at all, but that helps them... you use a Sprint to get into your opponent's DZ fast and start racking up VC3 points. With no damage, it will be on the bottom of the enemy's list of targets. Additionally, it can land to tie down artillery or support units while the rest of your forces move up.

The points you pay get you a function that few other units can. That's what determines high or low value... can any unit move as far a Sprint?

actually both the panthers are fairly decent, many of the industrials are fair pieces, and I use the merc crimson hawk from time to time very well.

I still say the worst mech going is the SS agro MK II mod. It's charge bait/capture bait/melee bait/ranged bait/arty bait/vtol bait/kitchen sink bait.

It can't move fast, has no ranged attack, fast dropping stats, bad heat, low attack, low defense, and short dial. On an elite no less.

SMASH vehicles. any one here whod like to waste 20+ pts? Although its quite useful for a paper weight though.

Worst army? HMM... Try putting mobile HQs or Rambulances in Maxims or J-37s or Garrotts just for fun.

HL (I still use HL for Highlander, LI for Liao) SM1 Tank Destroyers in formation. Better yet, use 3 HL Hauberks for an incredible 10 attack. Just 81 points!

Uhh - anybody notice that most of these units are Dark Age?

How bout the SW JESIII? I think when in prime it has a 8 or 9 attack...good damage (5 SU streak) but small ark and 4 min range. Also very slow.

That would be the JESII, but yeah, you pretty much pegged it. But, seeing as JESIIs are not fast to begin with and all have high minimum ranges, you really cannot mention the Wolf version without the rest. Besides, 5 ballistic damage is worth it. You use them like cheaper Behemoths...keep infantry around to support them and waste everything. Basing with cheap units does not work if they cannot get to your unit to base it...a lot of people rate units bad just because they can be based and made useless. Uh...okay. Does that mean that every 'Mech with dual minimum ranges is useless now that Maclovia exists and can trot up and be immune to them?