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NML Batgirl has the following special attack power:
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Once per turn, Batgirl may use Force Blast or Incapacitate as a free action. When she does, target opposing characters do not take knock back damage or pushing damage from this use.
Just wondering how this interacts with the new version of Force Blast?
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Give this character a power action and roll a d6; a single adjacent opposing character is knocked back from this character a number of squares equal to the result. When this character hits with an attack, you may choose that it generates knock back if it doesn’t already.
Can she use the second part of it? And if she can and does, can she then do the first part? Or do you have to choose one only?
The same question was asked about one of the Flashes. Basically, as long as a figure is able to use a power, it can use all the passive portions of the power. If you can use Charge, you are immune to knock back. If you can use Force Blast, you will be able to choose to deal knock back on hits. Because there is a stipulation involved with Batgirl, as soon as you use the "once per turn" free action to use Force Blast/Incap then she can no longer use those powers. So until she uses said free action, she can choose to deal knock back on hits per Force Blast rules.
Edit: The thread I was referring to is regarding Kid Flash.
NML Batgirl has the following special attack power:
Just wondering how this interacts with the new version of Force Blast?
Can she use the second part of it? And if she can and does, can she then do the first part? Or do you have to choose one only?
Not exactly sure what you're asking but...
1. She can Use Incap, and then knock back that character as per the second part of the new force blast.
2. She can attack a character with a close combat attack, and then knock back that character as per the second part of the new force blast.
3. After #2 (not incap) resolves, she can the use force blast as a free action.
4. Regarding Knockback damage, I'd say that she could use it when she kicks in the second part of the new force blast, but not when she uses the first part, since she'd be taking an action to do so. I could be wrong here and she may never be able to cause knock back damage, but we'll see.
She can use both parts. But regardless of which part her power will prevent Knock Back damage.
The second part is passive, it will activate when any attack is successful. It will not prevent you from using Force Blast as a Free Action.
Quote : Originally Posted by Necromagus
When I came on board as RA I brought with me a mission to meet the intent of a power/ability and a firm distaste for exploits or loopholes that circumvented the intention of a rule. That's where the Rules team comes in.
Related to this, if she uses incapacitate on a character with 2 action tokens, will it deal the 1 penetrating damage? Her powers says the target doesn't take pushing damage from her use of incapacitate, but I don't think the 1 penetrating damage counts as pushing damage, right?
Related to this, if she uses incapacitate on a character with 2 action tokens, will it deal the 1 penetrating damage? Her powers says the target doesn't take pushing damage from her use of incapacitate, but I don't think the 1 penetrating damage counts as pushing damage, right?
No, Penetrating Damage is not Pushing Damage.
Quote : Originally Posted by Necromagus
When I came on board as RA I brought with me a mission to meet the intent of a power/ability and a firm distaste for exploits or loopholes that circumvented the intention of a rule. That's where the Rules team comes in.
She can use both parts. But regardless of which part her power will prevent Knock Back damage.
The second part is passive, it will activate when any attack is successful. It will not prevent you from using Force Blast as a Free Action.
but isn't the new passive part of knock back optional? so if batgirl rolls doubles and hits, she can still knock back normally, and the target should still take knock back damage (since she didn't use the knockback)
but isn't the new passive part of knock back optional? so if batgirl rolls doubles and hits, she can still knock back normally, and the target should still take knock back damage (since she didn't use the knockback)
Correct, if you roll doubles you may choose that the knockback come from the doubles and not the power. The power only decides whether to knockback or not once a figure is successfully hit. The prevention of KB damage only applies when FB is the source of the knockback.
Correct, if you roll doubles you may choose that the knockback come from the doubles and not the power. The power only decides whether to knockback or not once a figure is successfully hit. The prevention of KB damage only applies when FB is the source of the knockback.
Actually if you roll doubles, you can not choose to use Force Blast as part of the attack. It is only when "it doesn't already"!
Quote : Originally Posted by Necromagus
When I came on board as RA I brought with me a mission to meet the intent of a power/ability and a firm distaste for exploits or loopholes that circumvented the intention of a rule. That's where the Rules team comes in.
Correct, if you roll doubles you may choose that the knockback come from the doubles and not the power. The power only decides whether to knockback or not once a figure is successfully hit. The prevention of KB damage only applies when FB is the source of the knockback.
Note that it says the target doesn't take knockback damage "from this use" of Force Blast. When used in an attack under the new rules instead of as a free action it wouldn't be "from [that] use" and thus would deal knockback damage, at least as I'd read it. I think her power will likely need an erratum to work as intended, but if it doesn't get one she just got even more beastly, especially when using Flurry against multiple targets.
Note that it says the target doesn't take knockback damage "from this use" of Force Blast. When used in an attack under the new rules instead of as a free action it wouldn't be "from [that] use" and thus would deal knockback damage, at least as I'd read it. I think her power will likely need an erratum to work as intended, but if it doesn't get one she just got even more beastly, especially when using Flurry against multiple targets.
Interesting point. I think force blast generated from that effect is intended not to have knockback dmg and I think the "this use" is a holdover from having only one way to previously use force blast. It will probably need errata, you're right. It does seem the "this use" refers to the free action once-per-turn usage described earlier in the power as its currently worded. Probably a special power they are looking into. Changing things from active to active and passive can mess up tons of wordings.
1. She can Use Incap, and then knock back that character as per the second part of the new force blast.
2. She can attack a character with a close combat attack, and then knock back that character as per the second part of the new force blast.
3. After #2 (not incap) resolves, she can the use force blast as a free action.
4. Regarding Knockback damage, I'd say that she could use it when she kicks in the second part of the new force blast, but not when she uses the first part, since she'd be taking an action to do so. I could be wrong here and she may never be able to cause knock back damage, but we'll see.
Regarding #1, Incap doesn't deal damage, so knock back would be at most 1 square from hitting characters that already have 2 tokens, right?
Stunning Blow would change things up a bit, though.