So they just killed off Donna Troy for no other reason than Young Justice was supposed to get a wake up call? What the heck is that? Superboy and Robin have already faced these situations in their own books. DC should have done us a favor and capped Arsenal and Impulse. The only problem being no one would care. One used to take drugs and sleep with assassins. The other had a whole series and still seemed to learn nothing.

I usually roll with the blows and take a wait and see approach, but I don't know if I'll follow TT or The Outsiders now. Donna was a great character. She deserved better than this. She could have been in The Outsiders with Nightwing.

I was excited, but it looks like Birds and Hellblazer will be the only DC books I buy for a while yet.

i dosagree

i think that she was a waste of a charachter and a needed fatality.

but hey, what do i matter

I thought you prefered the characters with strong moral compasses. She was the heart of the team, just as Nightwing was the head.

I always like to hear from you Metz. Whe your on a roll, you're the funniest guy on this site. Love your Bat-Rants. So what do you think of an Outsiders without Halo, Katana, Geoforce, or Black Lightning? I agree thay need Nightwing as a leader, but there's no need for the other newbies besides maybe Jade. The last run was great. It was mostly a victim of the industry implosion at the time.

i agree that batman and the outsiders was good. it was one of the era's of bats before he became LAME. and i am SO looking forward to nightwings outsiders, and im glad that metamorpho is back.(even though he's been practically everywhere the past 3 months) but like you said earlier, i will have to wait and see, cuz no-one will know how good it is til it comes out. i am a little worried about winnick on it though. i dont like his GA but his GL was...ok at best, EXILES is always good though. and all in all i didnt care for graduation day.

as for titans i am a huge geoff johns fan, i love the super-stuff and it has superboy. mckone is good/talented and from what ive seen he looks good on the book also. i also LOVE that impulse is officially becoming kid flash... thats AWESOME!!!

btw thanks for the compliment, it helps that there are posters like you that i enjoy relying to posts soo much

Briel - it probably would have been nice to have put a spoiler notice on your post. Especially since the subject doesn't indicate what the thread is about.

Now as to the actual subject...

I don't think Donna's death was pointless. I really think that there are only two people whose deaths would kill the Titans - Donna and Richard (bloody censor-bots). Now there was no way they'd get to kill Nightwing, and they had to kill Troia. The pointless death was Lilith. The only reason she was killed was to go "look how dangerous this robot is!"

As for the Outsiders, I do agree that I'd have rather seen some of the unused characters from the DCU than a bunch of newbies. Especially since the entire point of 'no more Titans' is that much of the death and destruction was because of the experienced 'newbies' from Young Justice.

I was completely disgusted with the entire Graduation Day mini-series. We get the generic 'robot from the future,' who mistakenly attacks our heroes. The impetuous youths don't listen to their experienced elders and trouble ensues. We get another robot who kills someone just to show how evil he is. And then the 'robot from the future' comes in and pulls a deus ex machina to save the day, not even allowing Donna's death to have the diginity of "I died, but I saved my friends." And at the end there still is no reason for the 'robot from the future,' other than a weak plot device to end the Titans and Young Justice. I wrote better endings for my comics when I was in grade school.

Although, given the ending with Donna and her multiple rebirths, who thinks in a year or two either the Titans or the Outsiders will end up in space and find this planet Donna is on?

Sorry about the lack of a "Spoiler." I was just so livid with this. I didn't collect this series for a long time, but I put the specific book into my saver when I saw the cover. This situatio reminded me of the mid-nineties where death was supposed to equal drama, and substitute for good writing. Marvel and DC being equal opportunity offenders. I was a big Titans fan, and even collected the first year of this last run. I only stopped, not because it was bad, but because, nothng really seemed to happen. This was overcompensation. This was editors saying, "look, the next book is going to be hardcore." I don't need hardcore, I just Need a plot. If I need hardore, I'll read my Hellblazer. Over in X-Men, the death of Colossus had a point, and was even a long time coming. I'm calmer now. I want to pick up The Outsiders. I think it is a testament to how cool Troy was, that I was upset with this, and I hadn't even read the book in years.

the real irritating thing about the graduation day is this.
1) this is more a positive thing but... I think it was a good idea to kill troia. that was the only main titan that they could kill because she really wasnt doing anything anymore. and because she WAS a main member for so long, it made her death all the more impact-ful.

2) dude i love D i c k (grayson). why did judd winnick make him so... stupid. roy and dik are all pissed that that donna's dead and decide that the titans are now disbanded because its just to dangerous and the danger out-weighs the bad (basically). i guess im just upset that he was all "NO! the titans are over! wahwahwah!!" where we all already know that in the next month the NEW titans and outsiders start again. AND ontop of that dicck decides to work with the machine that basically caused troia's death.
oh wait i get it... winnick and austen must die!!!

I really hated Graduation Day!

I liked Winnick on Exiles.

I like Austen on most of the things he is doing.

Yes, to have a believable "this is it, we're done" moment you had to kill off one of the original 5. Wally and D ick were immune because they both have popular titles of their own as well as regular appearances in other titles (Flash in JLA, Nightwing in the Bat-books). Roy and Garth aren't high profile enough and were both merely guest-stars during the Wolfman-Perez years. That leaves us with Donna. D ick has always been the head of the Titans and Donna has always been the heart. The heart was ripped out of the Titans, so it makes sense thematically that she had to die.

Yeah, there were several points where I wondered if Winnick has read anything with Nightwing from the last several years. Of course he wasn't the only person mis-characterized. If they hadn't specifically told us it was Lilith/Omen you certainly wouldn't have known it from the way she acted and talked.

I do hope Winnick does a better job on the regular title. In his defense, an interview with him about the mini-series did imply it was rushed. Hopefully that's the problem here and we don't have anything to worry about.

If he messes up this Outsiders revival I'll be truly annoyed, because it'll be another ten years before they try again. Ben Raab should be on this book. Read all his Excalibur work and you'll know it's true. I'll say it again. No Halo, Katana, or Black Lightning? What crack rock is this? I'll read it again (BL vol. 2), but I don't recall BL having a daughter. All these illegitimate kids (Connor, Roy's kid), and suddenly "I'm gay" characters are starting to make me wonder. Nothing against gay characters (I shouldn't even have to say that), just sudden orientation changes. Make a new character for that if you must. Strangely, Northstar always was, and the second he was outed, he had less adventures. Was he suddenly less cool? No. Getting off track, sorry. There seems to be a lot of strange things going on at DC lately, and strangely enough, they're not in Vertigo. I say this out of concern. I'm one of the few who has equal love for Marvel and DC.