It states in the universe quick-start rules:

"Note that flying and nonflying characters can't make close combat attacks against each other. They're too far away."

Does this mean that Wonderman can never close combat attack any grounded characters? Being that he has no ranged attack, he would seem to be pretty much a worthless character, if the above is indeed the case...

Pretty much, the Quick Start Rules are pre-empted by the full version of the rules later in the rulebook. At the very least, it is not the intent of the rules to prevent close combat attacks between fliers and non-fliers. (They may have meant "soaring and non-soaring".)

I'll point out that this is the first time they used this version of the Quick Start Rules *inside* the rulebook, although this may have been an insert in previous starter sets. It had never been taken as canon before.

Thanks, pseudo

so could M.O.D.O.K. hit a stealthed wolverine hiding in hindering terrain with a close combat attack?

No his arms are too short...

But seriously, yes he can, stealth has nothing to do with close combat attacks it only matters for line of sight.

So he can't outwit him (requires LOS)

he can't use psychic blast (can't make ranged attacks as he can't draw LOS)

But M.O.D.O.K. can hit him square in the nose with his stubby little fists, that somehow do 4 damage.

and sorry for the newb questions... I just started playing this game a little over a week ago, and my also newb friends keep arguing rules with me. They say my modok can't ever hit their stealthed characters in hindering terrain ever. They keep pointing to that clause in the quick start rules. I've had a hard time finding anything in the faqs (or in this forum) that proves otherwise. unless i can find proof that a hovering character can close combat a grounded enemy, I won't be able to convice them otherwise...

The important part is all you need is adjacency to make a close combat attack, not LOS. Stealth does not affect adjacency.

Sounds like it may be hard to convince them, then. The only text under "Close Combat" on page 17 of the Universe Rulebook is:

There's nothing here that says that you're explicitly allowed to attack adjacent flying characters if you're a non-flier, or vice versa. Your friends may argue that since it (seems to) prohibits it in one section of the rules, it would need to be cleared up in another section.

Now, their example of MODOK not being able to make a close combat attack almost makes comic book sense. If that's what they're basing the argument off of, what about Kingdom Come Superman? They're going to say that he can't land to hit Wolverine in a bush?

aside from comic book sense, if a hovering character cannot hit a grounded character with close combat then: zero ranged Wonderman, Captain Britain, and Northstar can't ever hit a grounded character with any hit at all, except throwing an object. If that's the rule, then superman could not hit a stealthed character either...

Back up:

Lets get our terminology right:

Grounded: Characters, objects, or terrain that is not elevated or soaring.

So a hovering character is grounded. Because in this example it is not elevated or soaring. All grounded characters that next to each other are adjacent unless separated by blocking terrain.

All adjacent characters can attack each other in close combat. Per the rule quoted above:

"Close combat represents hand-to-hand and melee weapon attacks.
Your character must be adjacent to a target to make a close combat attack."

Stealth or LOS never enters the equation.

ahhh ... but the glossary in the rulebook defines 'grounded' as "a character that is not soaring or hovering."

anyway, i should have not used the word 'grounded' in my above posts. the terms used in the quick-start rules are 'flying' and 'nonflying'.

They must have meant, 'soaring' and 'non-soaring'. I just have to convince my friends of the same. I hope a judge or arbitrator adresses this sometime somewhere in this forum. can't find anything concrete in the faqs or by useing this forum's search engine thus far.

This was changed in the FAQ the new wordining the glossary is:

Grounded: Characters, objects, or terrain that is not elevated or soaring.

Go to the how to play section on the heroclix web site and download the latest FAQ. Also there are links to this info at the top of this forum.

BTW: I really wish they would update the rules and PAC not just the FAQ when there is a correction to the rules or PAC.

Am I the only one that sees how much confusion having an incorrect rulebook and PAC available for download from the web site is?

New players are not going to know to download the FAQ!!!

The FAQ wasn't the problem this time. It was the inclusion of the Quick-Start rules with the regular rules. (And you won't see a FAQ addressing this because the Quick-Start rules are not meant to be part of the regular rules.)

Belacose, there isn't much more that you can do than let your friends know that the Quick-Start Rules are not part of the regular rules. They are meant to be quick rules so you can start playing right away. The real rules start on page 6 of the rule book.

And a hovering character may make a close combat attack on an adjacent non-flying character whether in stealth or not.