I was just curious. I was looking at the wording for both BFC and Haymaker, and it seems to me that they can work together. Both require the initial close combat action. BFC then states to roll a die, and replace the damage value with the number rolled. Could Haymaker then add +2 to the damage value after the BFC? The wording seems, at least to me, to work. It'd be neat to do 8 damage with Deadpool

B/C/F says you can use it when you give a fig a close combat action. Since Haymaker is activated by a close combat action you can use them together.

But, you would get the +2 to damage from Haymaker and then roll the B/C/F roll, which would replace your damage value... including the +2.

Bah! Darn. I was so hoping I could inflict even more pain with Deadpool

I have a crazy cool avatar I made. Actually, I made it as my wallpaper for my computer, but I can shrink it to use as an avatar. I'm just debating on whether I want to spend the $10 to put it up here.

Reading this, I was curious why you wouldn't still get the +2 from Haymaker, so I looked up Haymaker and BCF. The wording on BCF says "...roll one six-sided die....This roll replaces...." That's the kicker phrase, this roll replaces this character's damage value. The modification from Haymaker is to the damage value, so no duplication.

There. Crazy-cool avatar is up and running.

This was an idea I came up with a year ago, and I ended up with the same ruling, made me so sad. :disappoin


But when you get right down to it, think of how many BCF figures out there would be ridiculous with this card. DOFP wolverine hitting with an 11 attack for 3-8 damage?

Lord knows I wouldn't want this to work. But doesn't it run against the whole "Replace then modify" idea that has been decided on? I get that it's not going to work, but is there a rules reason I'm missing or is it just a fiat decision?

Tarnish

Its based on the timing of the effects. Haymaker modifies the figures DaV before the attack roll, but B/C/F replaces the figures DaV (and any previously applied modifiers) after a successful CC Attack. Since the CC Attack can't be successful until after the attack roll, Haymakers modifier gets overwritten by the result of the B/C/F roll.

The rules for Feats on pg 46 explains the timing for applying modifiers from feats based on what Combat Value is being modified, unless it is stated otherwise in the card text. ICwO for instance, has specific timing based on the text of the card.

I hope that cleared up your confusion.

BoT

The +2 bonus to damage and -1 to AV is added at the time the combat action is declared (i.e. before the attack roll, and waaaaay before the BCF roll). Since the bonus is applied before the BCF roll, which becomes the new damage value, the modifier is replaced as well. Just like if you tried to use Perplex on the Damage before using BCF.

If they were applied simultaneously (i.e. Transport move and attack penalty + sharing AVs with Sinister Syndicated/Batman Enemy) then it would indeed be "replace then modify".

Ah it did. I don't have access to the PAC or the Pounce Feat right now or I probably would've figured it out. Thanks.

Tarnish

<edit> and as always thanks to Normalview as well.

One question I still haven't gotten an answer to (despite asking numerous times) is how B/C/F interacts with Homing Device.
The process is similar, the difference is that Homing Device REDUCES the figure's damage - so, does B/C/F negate this reduction? Or is the process somehow different when the controlling player benefits from this way?

Homing Device works like Haymaker; the modifier (in this case, -1 to damage) is applied when the close combat attack is made. Since the die roll for BCF occurs after the attack is made, the -1 modifier is lost.

As such, the best characters to use Homing Device with are either Giants, Colossal characters (neither type have the starburst damage symbol, so they do not have the penalty applied) or characters with BCF.