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I would argue that going strictly by what is written in the Rulebook, that that is incorrect. Yes, you must give an action token to the figure that is using the theme PC. No where does it say when that token needs be applied, only that it is applied. Again, going strictly by the wording of the Rulebook, and the specific phrasing of when tokens are applied, they are applied at the end of the current action. The current action (again PC being not being any type of action) would be the resolution of the attack by the opponent. Damage is applied, action token is applied, pushing Damage is applied if applicable.
The action is the opposing figures attack.----> has the action resolved? No, because PC is not any kind of action. PC gets used, Attack is re-rolled. Action is resolved. Action tokens get placed on both figures.
I really don't see any gray area there, especially with the ruling that the +2 Shellhead modifier does not apply.
If that is the ruling that has been handed down, that's fine, but I think that the distinction needs to be made, and that the new Rulebook, or at least the Players Guide, needs to have a line that says 'Immediately give this character an action token for this use of Probability Control.'
Yes, generallty PC is a 'free action' thus garnering no token but in a Theme PC use (or CSA) a token is generated and the action generating said token is completed as soon as a re-roll is declared. Right?
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Yes, generallty PC is a 'free action' thus garnering no token but in a Theme PC use (or CSA) a token is generated and the action generating said token is completed as soon as a re-roll is declared. Right?
Incorrect. PC is not any kind of action.
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I would argue that going strictly by what is written in the Rulebook, that that is incorrect. Yes, you must give an action token to the figure that is using the theme PC. No where does it say when that token needs be applied, only that it is applied. Again, going strictly by the wording of the Rulebook, and the specific phrasing of when tokens are applied, they are applied at the end of the current action. The current action (again PC being not being any type of action) would be the resolution of the attack by the opponent. Damage is applied, action token is applied, pushing Damage is applied if applicable.
The action is the opposing figures attack.----> has the action resolved? No, because PC is not any kind of action. PC gets used, Attack is re-rolled. Action is resolved. Action tokens get placed on both figures.
I really don't see any gray area there, especially with the ruling that the +2 Shellhead modifier does not apply.
If that is the ruling that has been handed down, that's fine, but I think that the distinction needs to be made, and that the new Rulebook, or at least the Players Guide, needs to have a line that says 'Immediately give this character an action token for this use of Probability Control.'
Here's the thing, though:
Let's say you're right and you don't place the token until the action is resolved.
Then, let's say I'm playing a theme team and I've got 4 extra PC rerolls available to me.
Now, let's say I am trying like the dickens to hit your KC Flash and his durned 20 DV with my Forbush Man ('cause, you know, Forbush Man is awesome). And he misses, unfortunately, but no biggy since one of my other characters can draw LOF to Forbush Man and uses a theme team PC reroll. No token is placed though, because the action has not resolved.
Well, not unexpectedly, Forbush Man misses again. So, I choose to use another theme team PC with the same character. Still no token placed.
This goes on for another two attack rolls because F.B. just can't catch a break. Finally he admits defeat and the action resolves.
So... where do I put those 4 tokens? They certainly can't all go on the guy who actually used the theme team PC, since the theme team rules themselves don't let you put any tokens on a character who already has two tokens. So even if this character had no tokens at all prior to the rerolls, we'd still have two unassigned tokens? Clearly we should not have been allowed to use those extra PCs since that would cause extra tokens to not be assigned, but per your interpretation, there is nothing wrong with that scenario... you know, until you get to the actually placement of the tokens.
So, are you starting to understand why placing the token when the PC is used is so important? If not for me, do it for Forbush Man
We were playing a game, and came across what seems to be a fairly clear rules question:
We were playing a large game (800 pts). Thor's Mighty Charriot was taking a shot at Odin who had just made a move the previous turn (thus, Odin had one token on him).
Thor rolled double sixes. I declared that I was using team PB control, and declared that it was Odin that would recieve the Token. Odin then had two token on him, and I thus reminded my oponent that Shellhead was then activated.
He stated that he did not believe that Odin could be given the token (since he was the target of the attack), and did not think that the token placed would trigger Shellhead until the next attack (i.e., it would not activate for this attack since the original attack was already made and I was simply making him reroll the die).
We decided that Odin would be allowed to recieve the token for now, and that Shellhead would be activated; however, my oponent wanted to make sure this was a legal move.
So, were we right?
Thank you for your time.
I would say yes, but I haven't heard of this new ruling before now.
Last edited by MacGyver2506; 01/31/2010 at 20:17..
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No Shellhead bonus is applied. This has been ruled as such since it was first possible with CSA and Shellhead.
Quote : Originally Posted by Harpua
When [Back-Alley Brawl] came out, it was ruled that the attacker could get the +2 on the first attack, but if he was PCed by a friendly, then he'd lose that bonus on the reroll.
Ok. I used to judge Heroclix before I went to college, and I would always keep up to date on all the eratta and clarifications for figures and rules, but if the wording was as clear cut as these two scenarios, neither I nor anyone in my venue, nor the friends I played with thought to look it up because no argument arose from the action taking place...it would seem pretty clear...
Character (Odin) with one action token has normal defense. Thor attacks using no powers and gets +2 attack. Odin uses team PC, takes pushing damage, gains +2 defense, and Thor attacks again still using Back-Alley Brawl to gain +2 attack.
That's how I would have ruled it having not known about these two rulings.
So as someone who plays for fun now, with the occasional tournament in hopes of getting an LE, how do I find out what these rulings are?
I have seen several threads mentioning rulings such as these, but I haven't seen them in any of the Wizkids published documents. (unless I overlooked them) so where do I look for them? Who actually makes the rulings?
How much can you take, and keep moving forward?
The Green Lantern Corps is DC's version of the US Marine Corps.
So as someone who plays for fun now, with the occasional tournament in hopes of getting an LE, how do I find out what these rulings are?
I have seen several threads mentioning rulings such as these, but I haven't seen them in any of the Wizkids published documents. (unless I overlooked them) so where do I look for them? Who actually makes the rulings?
i remember these ruling but they only ever made it into the forums and not in any documents.
TBH i do not see anything in the documents that support the way the ruling for shellhead goes, i figured it would be the same as the way Back-Alley brawl goes.