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Probably the issue I was most looking forward to this month, with an equal mixture of excitement and trepidation. For probably obvious reasons.
And I was with it. Lobdell actually had me going along with it. The retcons, the changes, it all still made sense with the character. I was even fine with him being "Red" Robin from the start... I was completely sold....
...until Tim Drake doesn't actually figure out Batman's secret identity.
Oh, he got close, according to the book, closer than anyone else. But he still only followed a trail of breadcrumbs that the Bat left for him, leading to a fabricated identity.
I call BS. Complete and total. They can't let anyone, not even Tim Drake, one of his greatest allies, ever have the upper hand on the Bat. All to make him the more badass. Frack. I can't take it anymore. I'm practically going apoplectic here.
And yes, I know it's impotent nerd-rage. I get it. I'm guilty as charged. But dammit, it's Tim. It's at the core of his character, that he unmasked the Batman. That he was such a great detective he found out it was Bruce Wayne behind the cowl.
And now... it's not there any more. Oh, Bruce still praises his "innate detective skills," and his drive and gymnastics prowess. But that crowning achievement is gone. No way does this fly.
Argh. When will this nightmare end?!?!?!?
Quote : Originally Posted by Thrumble Funk
"I sit corrected. You and Owlman BOTH win the thread."
When it comes to Superman and Batman, Grant Morrison is nothing but a 50's cover band in a 70's psychedelic funk style.
You expected Scott Lobdell to write something consistently good? That's what I'm more surprised by. I was reading Red Hood & the Outlaws until issue 6, but it took me that long to realize he doesn't know how to handle DC characters properly, though many pointed that out with issue 1 & Starfire's sexuality.
Quote : Originally Posted by Early Cuyler in Squidbillies, "Fatal Distraction"
Hell, I don't want to hear the labor, I just want to see the damn baby
New 52 is worse every month. (That's coming from somene that loved the relaunch idea.)
It depends on what you're reading. From someone following zero Batman books, I like it. I stick to Swamp Thing, Animal Man, Demon Knights, Suicide Squad, Green Lantern, Action Comics, and the Legion books, and they all treat me well.
I sort of realized with the reboot that the Batman timeline was a house of cards. Too delicate to not screw up.
Quote : Originally Posted by Early Cuyler in Squidbillies, "Fatal Distraction"
Hell, I don't want to hear the labor, I just want to see the damn baby
No, I didn't expect Lobdell to write something consistently good. His work is extremely hit or miss, and mainly miss at that. But on the whole, unlike Red Hood & the Outlaws, Teen Titans hasn't been a disaster, taken for what it is.
I was pleasantly surprised that I enjoyed just about every other aspect of the issue. It's a good take on Tim in the updated continuity. Except for the BIGGEST THING about the character, and I'm absolutely positive it was a directive straight from editorial. This decision to make Tim a "second-rate detective" reeks of DiDio and Harras.
Quote : Originally Posted by Thrumble Funk
"I sit corrected. You and Owlman BOTH win the thread."
When it comes to Superman and Batman, Grant Morrison is nothing but a 50's cover band in a 70's psychedelic funk style.
New 52 is worse every month. (That's coming from somene that loved the relaunch idea.)
Aquaman has been great; Demon Knights is good; I've kinda enjoyed New Guardians.
Superman is what made me realize I hated the rest of the New 52. When he was written as a jerk instead of the penultimate good guy who says the right thing and does the right thing despite other heroes (and civilians) calling him naive or soft I lost all faith that these books would be worth their relaunch.
The way JL handled the battle with Darkseid also bothered me in the first 6 issues. However, in this case I was such a fan of the Justice League of America: Year One series that penned Manhunter, Green Lantern, Flash, Aquaman, and Canary as the original Justice League of America I just couldn't let it go.
The entire Robin/Red Robin debacle has really been bugging me since I heard about it and this simply justifies the nerd anxiety I felt coming.
I strongly disagree that learning Batman's secret ID was the "biggest thing" about the character. Even at the time, the way Tim figured it out was more like dumb luck than brilliant detective work.
The "biggest thing" about Tim for me was the fact that he recognized what was happening to Batman without a Robin to help him keep balance. That's what led him to approach Dick Grayson and try to convince him to return as Robin. When that didn't work, Tim took on the role himself.
Tim's intelligence is formidable, but it's always been his heart that drove him and made him a hero. That's why I've been a fan from his first appearance, and that's what it would take to keep me interested today.
Oh you definitely need to read the Nightwing #0 then just to irk you even more. Since you are giving out the spoiler, here's one for that book:
Spoiler (Click in box to read)
He figures out who Batman is basically because of a finger tap to the head
Oh, no, I'm absolutely fine with the Nightwing issue. I always pretty much thought that Dick had figured it out before Bruce told him, anyway. After he was taken in at the Manor, but before he was shown the Cave.
Had they left that integral part of Tim's origin intact, it would've gone a long way to making him Dick's equal, which I think is something that the brass at DC didn't want to do.
Quote : Originally Posted by Thrumble Funk
"I sit corrected. You and Owlman BOTH win the thread."
When it comes to Superman and Batman, Grant Morrison is nothing but a 50's cover band in a 70's psychedelic funk style.
What irks me most is just this part of how they handled Tim's new origin, and also certain changes in Jason's in the Red Hood & The Outlaws issue. By having Leslie Thompkins foist Jason on Bruce, that removes an important part of their relationship, that Bruce saw something in Jason and wanted to help him; afterwards, he'd always felt like he'd failed him.
These changes seem minor on the surface, but really effect the undercurrents of the characters' relationships, and that's what bugs me most of all.
Quote : Originally Posted by Thrumble Funk
"I sit corrected. You and Owlman BOTH win the thread."
When it comes to Superman and Batman, Grant Morrison is nothing but a 50's cover band in a 70's psychedelic funk style.
When DC decides to do another universe-wide retcon just because?
AND have a consistent and well thought out framework applied across the board.
Every reboot since (and including) Crisis hasn't worked because DC wants it both ways. They want to restart everything and keep their history. So they change things without paying attention to what that change affects. And what that second effected change affects. And so on.
AND have a consistent and well thought out framework applied across the board.
Every reboot since (and including) Crisis hasn't worked because DC wants it both ways. They want to restart everything and keep their history. So they change things without paying attention to what that change affects. And what that second effected change affects. And so on.
Said it before, and I'll say it again: this has been a constant deterrent to me, regarding warming up to DC.
I HATE change for the sake of change, and that seems to be their bread and butter.
Longest-Reigning Drunken HeroClix Champion - anyone got a liver?
And yes, I know it's impotent nerd-rage. I get it. I'm guilty as charged. But dammit, it's Tim. It's at the core of his character,
We all nerd-rage about different things. Personally, I'm pissed off about the change to Ocean Master in Aquaman #0.
Spoiler (Click in box to read)
Orm is still Arthur's half-brother. But instead of being fully human, Orm is now fully Atlantean. Orm didn't grow up jealous of Arthur's powers. No, Orm never knew Arthur. Instead, Orm grew up in Atlantis, killed Arthur's mom, and became king of Atlantis.
The core of Orm's character is completely changed. Grrr.