Ziran vs Nico - Nico had the potential to use a power that Ziran is testing for.

Scarlet Witch vs Wildcard - The Wildcard has the potential to use another Team Ability SW is trying to cancel.

It seems like both questions hinge upon whether or not the potential to use a power/ability qualified a figure to be affected by Ziran/SW.

Would the answer be any different if a Wildcard had already been given a free action to copy the team ability that SW was trying to cancel? From the wording of SW's power I'd say it would.

Yep. If the wildcard has already declared Mystics then they definitely would have to roll and this has already been verified a couple times. But I'm saying even if they haven't copied it yet they still have the ability to, they still "can use" it.

I see now, this is the classic debate of needing an additional term to distinguish between those that can potentially do whatever and those that are doing it in a way that interacts with other powers. This is a tough one and I do not envy the people in charge of wording these powers, but I agree it would cut down on some questions if they could make the distinction.

Look at it this way.

My team has a Wild Card, a Mystic TA, and a Police TA. My Wild Card used a free action to use Police TA, and is still currently using it. Scarlet Witch uses No More Mutants and chooses Mystics TA. Does my Wild Card still need to roll to see if it can no longer use Mystics TA? No, because he can't use it when NMM checks for it.

If you cannot use the chosen TA when checked, you are not affected by the effect. Potential is irrelevant for the Trait.

I get what you're saying, and think it's a valid question that needs a ruling. IMO if Nico can't pass Ziran's tests, by the same reasoning the undeclared Wildcard (or a Wildcard using a different TA) won't be affected by SW's power.

This makes sense to me. I get the whole idea that wildcards don't care if the character from whom they are copying a team ability are able to use it or not, thanks to Scarlet Witch. I also understand that we have what amounts to an official ruling earlier in the thread. But, if wildcards "can use" a team ability, shouldn't they be rolling a die as well as the characters that actually possess it when Scarlet Witch uses her trait? And if so, shouldn't that prevent that TA from being used by wildcards for the rest of the game, if they don't roll successfully?

"A wild card begins the game not using any other character’s team ability"

If they aren't using the team ability they can't use it. Can isn't an optional thing in heroclix. As soon as a character 'can' use something they are using it.

Unless you are trying to say that they CAN use all team abilities, which means they are using them all the time without needing a free action.

If a character says they CAN use Battle Fury they are using it, there is no choice. By the same game logic they would be using mystics, avengers and every other team ability that is copyable.


Wild cards can't use it until they are given a free action.

Actually a change to NMM's wording to:
NO MORE MUTANTS: Once per game, give Scarlet Witch a double power action and choose a team ability. Any other character that is using that team ability must roll a d6 that can't be rerolled and if the result is 1 - 5, that character can't use the chosen team ability for the rest of the game.

would make things easy.

Your change to the wording is exactly my point. It needs clarified. I am trying to say that wildcards can use all copyable team abilities possessed by friendly characters on the board. They have the capacity to use them, whether they currently are using them or not. I agree this is very similar to the Ziran example. And I'm sure that I'll lose this arguement in the end. But my goal and main point is that the intention isn't clear, there's no cut and dry printed rule wording (that I can find or have been shown) that answers the question and it needs a slight wording errata one way or the other.

Just a quick question on this subject. Do ATAs follow this same rule? If Scarlet Witch turns off an ATA, can wild cards still copy it?

Yes. Just like regular TA's, the character(s) may not be able to use the ATA, but they still possess it.

You've stated this exactly as I would have, except I was prepared to call Pimp Man and Ho-Woman over from the Nico/Ziran thread. If Spider-Man's been given a free action to copy Police, he can't use Mystics and therefore doesn't fall under the watchful gaze of No More Mutants as posited here. Additionally, I'd point out that when Scarlet Witch uses NMM, Spider-Man can't be given the free action to use Mystics anyway because it's somebody else's turn. That doesn't affect the completely valid and correct logic dairoka uses here, but it's another hole in the "can use"="can potentially use" argument. There's standard English and HeroClix English. The game uses HeroClix English for the rules, so don't use standard English to try to understand them.

They cannot. From the Rulebook:

A wild card may be given a free action to use a single team ability that a friendly character possesses. A wild card may be given this free action more than once per turn (this is an exception to the rule that characters can’t activate the same free action more than once per turn). A wild card begins the game not using any other character’s team ability.

Wild Cards start the game using only their own TA(s).
Wild Cards can only use a single friendly TA at a time.

NO MORE MUTANTS: Once per game, give Scarlet Witch a double power action and choose a team ability. Any other character that can use that team ability must roll a d6 that can't be rerolled and if the result is 1 - 5, that character can't use the chosen team ability for the rest of the game.

When Scarlet Witch activates No More Mutants, chose a TA. As a result of that Power Action, every character that can use that TA has to roll. A Wild Card that is not using that TA at that moment cannot use that TA during that Power Action, and will not have to roll.

Can you show any rules that will support that a Wild Card would have to roll for a TA that they cannot currently use?

Fair enough