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What we do is use the Poker Chips as well, Like most it lets Everyone know whats there and helps Future plays. But we've added Twist, We also use
" Black & White " Poker Chips For " Outwit & Perplex "
I have horrible Short Term from an accident. Doing this helps me So Much.
Anyone reading this should try it out. like it keep doin it, don't go back. Just trying to Help out anyone with the same problem.
And now to come in with the dissenting perspective...
First of all, I understand that clearing is not optional, but that doesn't necessarily mean that if doing so has been forgotten that you just automatically get to do it.
Remember that Mystics is not optional, but if you realize that someone forgot to take it a while back, well, you chalk that up as a misplay and move on, but you can't just apply it at that time.
I see this as the same thing.
Those tokens let both players know who is and is not able to do what. It is entirely possible that I move somewhere because I know I'm safe based on seeing two action tokens on a character. Now it comes around to your turn and you suddenly say "Oh, this guy shouldn't actually have any tokens on him. I'm just going to remove those now. Hey. Look at that. I can now plaster that guy for 6 damage." Sorry, but I'm calling foul on that.
It's a misplay on the part of both players, though with far more responsibility on the part of the controlling player.
Friendly game, yeah, I'll let it slide and have had many opponents allow me to do the same when I've missed something.
Competitive game, probably not, like Mystics and other such things, there's really nothing that can be done to roll back the clock. You just have to keep going with the way things are.
(Obviously, none of this is a black and white answer. There are shades of grey all over the place here.)
Hm.. I got your point. I asked wizkids for this question too and they disapprove it. They said that something like this should be asked to judge or the other player approvement. They said it's something that I have to ask individually.
I kinda disappoint at how this thing doesnt have exact ruling and how wizkids answer it like they dont even know what to do.
Forgot... Ok. My mistakes. But still, there's gotta to be something we can work out to this problem.
Hm.. I got your point. I asked wizkids for this question too and they disapprove it. They said that something like this should be asked to judge or the other player approvement. They said it's something that I have to ask individually.
I kinda disappoint at how this thing doesnt have exact ruling and how wizkids answer it like they dont even know what to do.
Forgot... Ok. My mistakes. But still, there's gotta to be something we can work out to this problem.
Oh, as far as judging goes, it would need to be evaluated on a case by case basis.
Oh, as far as judging goes, it would need to be evaluated on a case by case basis.
Yeah, that's true for anything like this that's missed by both players. Really, as long as nothing else has happened that would have been impacted by the missed effect, there's no reason it can't be resolved.
In the case of clearing tokens, if you miss a token on one of your guys, and pass the turn, then you (or your opponent) realize it before they do something during their turn that would be impacted by said missed token, there's no reason it can't be cleared.
Now, if your opponent goes to say, Incap that guy you forgot to clear, and you let the action proceed and don't realize it until he's made an attack roll that this Incap is going to push you because you forgot to clear, its a little fuzzier.
In higher level play, I wouldn't expect the judge to rewind the action, especially if there are any disagreements between the players as to what exactly has happened in the mean time.
At the local level, personally, I'd try my best to rewind. That's obviously very dependent on the exact situation, though. Forgetting to clear a token is probably one of the easiest things to fix, generally.
The important thing in these situations is to not be afraid to call the judge over. Calling a judge to clear up a game state error doesn't make you a jerk. Especially if you're the one that made the error in the first place. Don't be afraid to call a judge on yourself. We're not there to punish people, we're there to help everybody play the game correctly (as best as any of us can).
Yeah, that's true for anything like this that's missed by both players. Really, as long as nothing else has happened that would have been impacted by the missed effect, there's no reason it can't be resolved.
In the case of clearing tokens, if you miss a token on one of your guys, and pass the turn, then you (or your opponent) realize it before they do something during their turn that would be impacted by said missed token, there's no reason it can't be cleared.
Now, if your opponent goes to say, Incap that guy you forgot to clear, and you let the action proceed and don't realize it until he's made an attack roll that this Incap is going to push you because you forgot to clear, its a little fuzzier.
In higher level play, I wouldn't expect the judge to rewind the action, especially if there are any disagreements between the players as to what exactly has happened in the mean time.
At the local level, personally, I'd try my best to rewind. That's obviously very dependent on the exact situation, though. Forgetting to clear a token is probably one of the easiest things to fix, generally.
The important thing in these situations is to not be afraid to call the judge over. Calling a judge to clear up a game state error doesn't make you a jerk. Especially if you're the one that made the error in the first place. Don't be afraid to call a judge on yourself. We're not there to punish people, we're there to help everybody play the game correctly (as best as any of us can).
I Judge for on of our clubs in South Africa, the way we do it is as follows:
1. Its not optional, so must be done even if late unless...
2. by doing it will make a situation in play or an action in play that was done by the opposing character pointless or redundant, meaning, if it will change the impact of what the opponent has done in his/her turn. In this case, we will try to roll back to the beginning of turn only IF BOTH players can agree to figure placement etc from beginning of turn, if not, then it stays as is with the tokens still on it.
3. If the opponents turn has just started and it is then picked up, then no harm no foul.
4. if the play has gone all the way around back to the original player who had forgotten to clear, and then they remember, then sorry for you but you will get to clear this turn. This is because there is an extremely high chance that your opponent played his entire turn with the idea in mind that the figure had 2 tokens.
Whilst there are base rules that have to be enacted, there is also this one:
Okay, I get it now. I think I'll go with agreement from both player to clearing token when I play casually. If its tournament or some official battle and forgot clearing action token, it will remain there (i kinda like how agrotog explain point number 4). How's that?