Man i love to play games that I make my own rules to too!

ah man... more rule changes?

This is a particular user's house rules suggestions. Some run ideas through out the thread. Its not that long, should check the rest of it out.

~Phil

You can stay sane knowing that most of his changes won't go live but he has hit some nails on the head before.

I demand to know what Brazil thinks about all this! I want his opinion in full, with a table of contents and footnotes!

Ha true enough. Those threads sure are fun to read, and while I kinda consider this a "classic" thread, especially because the origional post was SO long and convoluted. However, there just isn't much trolling going on in here, so I don't think it would have been deemed entertaining enough to get into his list.

I feel that in a game with a maximum of 11 health, being able to hit for 10 damage is bad for the game. There have been heavy hitters with Flurry before, and there's always been flurry B/C/F combo pieces, but at the stipulation that they had to rely on team mates or to wait a turn before they used such a potent combination. Charge flurry just gives way too much reach to figures than can deal out 8-12 damage in a single action worth of attacks.

But it does! While it is true that you can outwit something else if you don't need to worry about damage reducers, why bring a psychic blaster or an exploit weakness piece when you could just bring, more outwit? EW and PB only have the synergies with charge and running shot, that is the only reason people bother with them in a competitive sense. Without that synergy, RCE and CCE would be better in every single situation that didn't involve an opposing character rolling 5 or 6 damage on their impervious roles. Outwit works on everything, while EW and PB only work on 3 standard and a handful of special powers in the game. One is so much more versatile, unless you've got a long ranged running shot, or are charging around a corner, why bother at all? You may be able to Psychic Blast 12+ squares away, but figures can move and outwit too, giving outwit a 17-22 range on most pieces that possess it. EW and PB are sandwiched between outwit and CCE/RCE in terms of usefulness, and I think something that could differentiate them a little more would be good for the game, especially if it tones outwit down, because everyone knows how good it is.

The answer is that every figure needs move and attack base line, clearly.

i was just kidding around.

oh no you didn't just say the b word.

@UltraDRGN

Thing is you can't running shot and then outwit in mid stride. Outwit has to be done before or after the action. Outwit to me faces some hard problems. If you make it so that a 1-99 point figure can't negate a 200+ figure you force support powers on high cost figures or inflate general point cost which makes 300pt games a thing of the past. Then you have option of making people roll for it. The problem is that people would have to pack more outwit to be effective and special power outwits will get even sicker.

The thing that you did hit on that I agree with to an extent is that exploit weakness and psiblast hit a mid ground. That means that they are balanced. But what if those two powers ignore super senses as well. Then we might get somewhere. Then you have a reason to have those powers over outwit. Here is why. That if a defense value changed from imperv to super senses then there is no need for another outwit.

I wouldn't mind of psyblast/exploit prevented all defensive powers from working. Special powers in the wrong slot complicate this a bit, but I'm sure you understand what I mean. I just like tiered damage reduction for simplicities sake.

If anything I think the CCE and RCE should be +1 attack and +1 damage instead of +2 damage, but that's just not a really important change so I didn't bother to list it. Both those powers are plenty good as is.

I would agree with that CCE and RCE change. But it does change a good number of figures ability to break Invulnerability. The Avenger's Ultimate Captain America comes to mind, with a 12 attack and 1 natural damage the CCE's +2 damage is what keeps him dangerous.

So I've tried to rationalize in my head that its okay for a master of close combat or range combat fighting to be able to adjust how they would like to use up to +2 of modification to their stats.

~Phil

in response to ultraDRGN very good and thought provoking post, i say this!
FLURRY: like it. i agree that charge flurry can be too much, especially in conjunction with perplex. sure skrull elektra isnt game breaking when she uses charge/flurry, but what happens when you perplex her damage up by 1? or 2?

PLASTICITY: love it. dont know why its taken so long to get any kind of rule or feat card to boost plasticity into the realm of useful.

STEALTH: like it. what do you think of stealth as a 'saving throw' rather than a set power, i.e. 'lines of fire to this figure are blocked on a roll of 3+. if a figures LOF is blocked it may choose another target' etc. on a side note, seriously, how stupid is SI invisible woman's version of this power? range 7? when the majority of pieces in the game have range 6? they should change her name to mostly visible female or something.

FORCE BLAST: LOVE THIS IDEA! i would also love to see a character with a combo of P/T and FB with this change. i would also love to see FB effect smoke cloud, i.e. remove 2 smoke cloud tokens within 1/2 range, or something to that effect.

HYPERSONIC SPEED: what if you just couldnt use an object w/hypersonic? this power is still a game breaker. its funny that everyone complains about superman with hypersonic, but my god ms. marvel is so much worse, at least you can draw lines of fire to superman if you can get to him.

BLADES/CLAWS/FANGS: i dont now like this idea, however it seems to me that B/C/F should never do 6 as it is. why not change the power to d3 or d4 damage, which to me seems like a more accurate portrayal of the amound of damage these weapons can do in the superhero genre. if a character has special abilities that ramp up their damage with their chosen weapon, then show that in stats or in PAC powers (EW, CCE, etc)

SMOKE CLOUD: like it. you are right that smoke cloud is a sad entry on any dial, and no one would miss it if it was gone. that said, i think that using it in the same way you applied your FB idea would work just as well, as in, at the end of a move or as a free action in conjunction with another action.

IMPERVIOUS/INVULNERABILITY/TOUGHNESS: like it. sounds reasonable enough.

REGENERATION: not sure if i get it, are you saying i can regen if i gave this character a standard action but not a free one? i'm not opposed to it either way, just not sure if thats what you meant.

PERPLEX: like it. perplex got a huge shot in the arm with the FF4 starter allowing full turn perplex, and i would say it has become the most used power in my venue due to its WIDE variety of uses, so thank god for the rule of 3...i can get behind the perplex adjustments because dropping 3 on any stat is kinda lame. i cant say i havent done it, but then, i am kinda lame.

MIND CONTROL: here is my idea of an adjust to MC feedback, character doesnt take feedback if controlling points do not exceed their own. so a 200 pt piece wouldnt take feedback unless trying to control someone more powerful then themselves. MC should also not require a clear LOF because you dont gotta see em to take over their mind do you?

INCAP:i really like incap, but you are right when you say its useless on higher point pieces with only one lightning bolt. likewise, with EE. i am not a fan of EE except in the rarest of circumstances. with these i would say, when using these 1/2 damage instead of 0/1 per hit. i.e.: incap would halve the attackers damage when making the attack along with adding a token. when a figure uses EE halve their damage. this is the amount of damage each figure takes when hit by this power. the EE change would be a big boost to the power, however it seems appropriate when a figure with 4 damage attacks that it can do more than 1 per figure of splash damage.

BARRIER: i actually kinda like barrier the way it is, but understand the frustration with it, especailly when it is on attack pieces i.e. star saphire, justice etc. i think the dial makers need to adjust their use of it. for example, barrier is fantastic on lisa drak. she is a perfect barrier option, but not so much on Ganthet. if barrier is character accurate, do something like they did with arkillo. i have never heard anyone say arkillo is broken with his free barrier ability and it seems to capture the ability of his power rings protective capacity. maybe thats what the alternate GL team ability should be!

LEADERSHIP: tough one. if feats are going away, then this wont be as useful to tack contingency plan onto (another of my venue's favorites...) what about +1 to attack for all friendly characters w/in 6 spaces, or give a character w/in 6 spaces a power action to heal 1 click of damage, or charcters w/in 4 spaces that have a lower point value have indominatable. idk, these are just brainstorms.

i know, its too long to read, but i wanted to chime in on ultraDRGN's very fun to read post. have fun tearing this apart.

Just the opposite actually. You get to regenerate as a free action when you clear the piece with regeneration. Meaning you still can't heal and then do something in the same turn, but you don't get an action token for regenerating so you are fresh the following turn.

Appreciate it. And your post isn't even close to too long. Do you have any idea how many days the origional post took to write? The answer is... more than 1.

great thread

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All this talk about new rules seems like the perfect flimsy pretext to bump this thread. Try to keep discussion on the first 2 posts as many of the pages after that are discussing things that have been altered.