That's a nice piece you've written, Xyberbratt. I like your attitude! That being said, it's quite remarkable to see this thread still being around, alive and kicking! Nice.

hello Xyberbratt,

Care to comment on how the abovementioned Hasbani armies would fare against the Bekker army that I posted?

I am interested in seeing it from the perspective of hardcore SS players since I see things from a SW point of view. This would be very helpful to me since I use both factions.

Thanks very much!

- OliverB

Well, you can read the comments on each SwSw army, and see the points. As for HtH, some of that's in the earlier posts. And some of it comes down to player styles. But I'll go HtH with this Geoff army, from the perspective of the 450 army that counter to ncluff's army that I posed.

Dereck Hasbani 286
SS HbS x3 15(45)
DI Towed AA arty x2 32(64)
Hazen's Strikers 20
SRM Team 16
Towed Autocannon 19
-450 points

Tossing aside what the opponent would place for terrain, I'm sticking with offering 2 W5's and 2 B3's. I'll ensure that at least one of the W5's gets out running up the battlefield, maybe start it at center, maybe 6" off my DZ. Then, depending on what else is out, I'll either place the other W5 to complement the first (if the Opp places blocking that benefits me) or place a B3 (for Streaks, if they place water or hindering)

assume I go first
T1: Move Dereck 6"/move HbS formation 13"/fire DITAA (1 at the Sniper, 1 at the Minigun Cycles, and 1 at Trike Squads)
T2: Resolve (aim drift to ensure hit to the Sniper, dont' care about the others. Move D <6". Fire DITAA (1 at Sniper, 1 at Minigun Cycles, 1 at Trike Squads)
T3: Resolve arty, that makes 2 to the Sniper, maybe 2 to the other infantry. Sniper has 1Streaks, and IT. Geoff has moved some at this point. I'm <12" in, he's up to 12" in, that puts us <6 inches apart. If in water, fire. If not, see where Geoff is, and either send an HbS to base, or fire anyway. (Geoff is no more than 20 or 21 Def at this point so it's a 10 or 11 to hit....) Clear shot, Geoff takes 6, blocked he takes 5. Let's assume I wasn't in water and missed the roll, I take 4. That puts them both at the same point. (If in water, or make the roll, Geoff is in serious trouble) Fire DITAA (1 at Sniper, other two wherever)
T4: Resolve, that makes 3 on the Sniper. By this point, either the trikes or miniguns are close to DZ. If in water, Dereck might have passed on the shot at Geoff to take the shot at the cycles/trikes. If they came close enough. But if he's pretty central, it would be hard for them to come downfield without getting into range. If they are close, go after them with the inf formation. If not, don't worry about them.
T5: etc. etc. etc. etc.

By T5, I'm thinking about T8. Or at least I better be. After that first shot, Geoff isn't alot of threat. Dispose of him at leisure. Keep him from shooting HbS's. Use HbS's to go after Sniper, harrass Geoff, or run interference.

This matchup all comes down to who makes that first shot. If Geoff is allowed to get to his spot, he's dangerous. If not, he's cake. Two shots from Dereck, and he's hurting bad. A third and he's Salvaged. I'll risk the ammo explosion to Salvage that Mech.

That give you an idea of what you wanted?

In all honesty, if just a little of that whole rant makes people stop and think about playing this game the way it was intended instead of all the "competitive players must play this way" garbage, that's all that matters to me.

Like I said, there's a great crowd for MW in the Eastern MA area, and most of New England. Anyone that wants to see the "Play it the way it should be played" philosophy in action is welcome to check it out anytime you happen to be in the area.

Ok, I'm all for trying risky armies, but this set up dies a fast and flaming death if I go second and face ATV's. Heck, I only own 3 Liao pieces and they're ATV's. Using ATVs in a DF pure army can't even be called cheesy. ATVs are THE support for BH. I've never seen Geoff Bekker, but BH and I are like poker buddies. And I'm into him for a mint.

I can go without the Zahn, but in that case, I dump the TAC too. I'll only use it dropped. It's too immobile, otherwise.

So, let's try this

Dereck
HB x1
DI AAA x1
SFT x2
GDSA x2
Kage BA x3

Set up:

DI AAA
-GDSA x2
-SFT x2

Dereck
-Kage BA x3
- HB

I just can't make myself leave the arty unprotected unless someone can sell me on how it would ever come into the game.

Thanks for all the input, xyberbratt and others. It really helps me think through the planning.

BH gives my Bekker weekly headaches. Lousy Donars :-)

Yes, but he asked for an army against Bekker, and that's what this was. A slight mod, that would work against Geoff. Against DF and BH, you could use the same army, but with much different placement, and tactics.

Ahhh, but you have advantages with Bekker that the donars can't match, if you use them right.....

But this thread is about Hasbani LOL

No, No, No! It's about me! Me, Me, Me! Doesn't anybody care about MY needs? :cheeky: :cheeky:

We are exploring the possibilities of Hasbani armies by pairing him off against my favorite army build after all. It helps all of us :-)

Hello Xyberbratt & Ncluff,

Thank you for the input. I'll design a similar Atlas army soon and compare notes!

On to the duel:
Many SW players learn that they have to play the game and get to their sweet spots. I intend to avoid Hasbani till I get to the spot and keep him busy in the mean time.

For one thing. The Miniguns & Trikes plus the Tora's Claw outnumber the 6 SS defending units, and half of them are in static positions allowing me the option to secure VC3 as well. Two arty is a bit risky so an SS A4 could be a better choice since it is less order intensive than 2 DI Towed AA (nice unit).

Bekker is never played as an assault mech killer on a toe to toe basis. The infantry can approach the SS dz real quick and jump from 9 to 11 mov upon taking 1 damage. (The 1 Damage arty will benefit all sw units by taking them close to their prime spots) They are intended to base-break the atlas till it overheats while the Kodiak stomps the other defending units.

The accuracy (virtually 12 to hitdue to the 3 in. blast) & repairable nature makes this a lethal unit and can neutralize any arty after 2 volleys. I believe that the Sniper arty can fire nearly every turn since it can be put back in the transport or repaired by the J37. Good to have that option!

Furthermore, the numerical superiority can be exploited to tie down Hasbani till Bekker is at prime. Base break ensues till the Atlas or Kodiak is left standing.

It is not a sure win, but a lot of the abovementioned items indicate the odds favoring the Wolf army in this particular duel.

Still, theory don't mean a thing compared to an actual game. Thanks for the input, I really appreciate it!

- OliverB

(howdy Ncluff, I'll post my Hasbani Army soon enough, thanks for the patience!)

Of course, we ALL care about you LOL

Ahh, but while you read the army, you skipped the tactics. The idea is simple. Don't let Hasbani get tied up, and don't let Bekker have a chance to use those Streaks. I will guarantee you, he won't reach that sweet spot.....

The Sniper is ok, but certainly not "repairable". He'll get more accurate, but less dangerous, right up until he hits that repair marker. I can hit him every turn, with the two DITAA's, without pushing. He hits for that first shot, one of them. Then has to wait a turn. Then hits maybe the first one, maybe the other. Either way, that leaves the other one to shoot. So, you shoot, rest, shoot, rest, and are at that repair marker, while you've dealt 4 clicks to one or the other arty. (yes, blast radius considerations have to be taken into account when placing)

Your infantry won't make it to base contact. You're leaving out the "other DZ defender" Dereck. How many of your infantry can take 6 and move off? How effective are they when the formation is broken up? All of a sudden, becoming alot more order intensive, is a bad way to go about with the game.

And, the J37? You have to get the orders from somewhere to use it. You're pretty tight right now on orders, alot of pieces, several formations. By the time you can spare an order, it may not matter. And loading the Sniper is just going to slow you down, orderwise. Dropping arty is order expensive, and a waste of time in most situations. It costs you 4 orders to pick it up, drop it off, fire and resolve. You take the push, but aren't doing alot there to really help the J37. You're out the four orders, meanwhile, I've got 3 pogs on each of the DITAA's, with only one target I really want to worry about. What are the odds that I'll focus fire the DITAA, and ensure that no matter where you deploy, there's a pog nearby?

Geoff can be ignored for a long time. Taking care of the infantry, and the Sniper, will put enough VC1 points and VC2 points in my column to win. He'll have no targets, no shots, so won't use that SU equip. Eventually, he'll close. And get shot.

Of course, it all comes down to that moment. Which big mech hits the other first. The one that scores the shot is going to win 90% of the games.

I figured that this is a great reason to drop by and have a game or two dude. Too bad our zip codes are inconveniently distant!

At least the Hasbani thread is surprisingly healthy. Still, I am a supporter of cheap & fast infantry. I do not intend to drop arty all the time, but your point is well taken. The great part is I am expecting a match similar to our exchange so it is a good help.

Btw, why not use the A4?

Double post, @#!%