Man... can't you tell when I'm joking?

You also forgot that you can EOME with an empty board (which is many times the case on turn 3).

That's why I still don't understand why Mobilized is priced as high as it is. I would rather just use the team-stamped searches (which in my case is advantageous because all the teams I like have them... except for Arkham).

If it really takes you a half an hour to proof read a quick post,
this might help

thanx guys

Um... this is an NPE built from essentially "garbage" cards spread across almost every set. It's not like the guy brought Squadron or QuickFate and ran smash-face wild on everyone. He built a unique and highly creative deck that should be celebrated as opposed to bad-mouthed.

I got a PM from aceswolf (as others did as well, I'm sure) saying that his playgroup had built this deck "months ago" and that they decided then that it was "broken". I'm not sure of how they came to this decision or what criteria was used to determine the "brokenness" of the deck.

How this was handled within the confines of the event is a different story. I personally don't see how any "new" players would know the difference between a solid constructed deck that wins out during a tourney and one that is "broken" due to lack of play interaction that wins out in a tourney...without someone calling it out and bringing it to their attention.

If that is the case, any negative "cheerleading" is bound to bring those who lost to said deck over to the "this is an NPE" side. It sounds as if this kind of talk went on in the store during the event (since aceswolf says he polled the players).

aceswolf also brought a "tier 1" deck to the event: Checkmate/LOA/Merlyn Abuse. If there was any concern about cries of "foul", you'd think the very person making those cries would have distanced himself from playing such a deck in a "casual" format. If he were here, I'd ask aceswolf how he would have dealt with such comments if his deck had swept the field (as it has done in multiple RP tourneys across the country).

I'm still scratching my head to understand this issue of broken vs unbroken decks. If the player in question didn't cheat and simply put something together that makes use of an innovative combo or technique to dominate the field, then good for him.

As a new player, I personally would not want someone pulling their punches to make it easier for me to win...that has a name and it's called patronizing and it stinks. Since I'm new I EXPECT to lose more than I win...I'm still learning to be a better player. If substantial prizes are up for grabs I'd be even more surprised if the veterans weren't bringing their best deck and game to the table.

As a last resort, if one player repeatedly brings decks the rest of the regulars consider "broken" and it's having a significant negative impact on the enjoyment of the group, invite the person to play somewhere else...nothing says you have to include them. This would tend to solve the problem from within.

Losing in and of itself won't drive newbies away from the game. Experienced players who are arrogant and like to bash the noobs when they beat them, that would make someone think twice about the hobby. If you want to keep the new players, arrange events so that they primarily play other new players until they're ready to advance to more competitive play. In the same vein, if you're a more experienced player and you beat a newbie be gracious and take a moment to offer some suggestions or encouragement to make him better. The player will appreciate it and you'll have done your part to "spread the vs love".

As for Aceswolf, if you enjoy the game play, if you don't any longer then quit. This is a hobby after all and when it's stressful or seems like work it's time to stop. Just the same, if you want to post on a vs forum do it, if you're thin skinned enough to have your ego bruised because of some criticism then don't. Regardless of your choices don't be surprised if the majority really doesn't care either way. I don't know you and have nothing against you but posting "I'm leaving" and then lurking to see what people might say about it is just a bit too self-centered and arrogant to me.

Just my 2 cents...

And be limited to 4 searches?

8 searches are better than 4, and 12 are better than 8, etc ...

Considering the number of decks where they have Straight to the Grave or team stamped tutors in addition to Enemy ... having Mobilize in addition to the team stamped tutors make just as much sense.

And, Mobilize is one of the cards that can fit in as many decks as Enemy ... it isn't restricted by the "infinite color wheel". It has a powerful effect, it is generic, it is from a set which is otherwise underwhelming rare wise [in many people's opinions apparently] ... therefore it recieves Enemy like money.

And, there has been few large events with it legal to show it's effectiveness [or ineffectiveness] thus it's price is partially based on speculation.

Worked for me!

You'd think by now I'd be able to, huh. I'm just full of surprises. :)

I think there are a few reasons Mobilize is priced so high:

1) It's still a card people want. All things being equal, the majority of teams will get 1 tutor card, which means they can play 4 copies in a deck. But 4 copies isn't enough to guarantee you won't miss a drop. Adding a couple copies of Mobilize into a mono-team deck that already has 4 other tutor cards improves consistency dramatically. Furthermore, when playing mono-team, Mobilize can actually be better than the team stamped tutor. One example is The B Team, which is great if you want to splash characters, but is inferior to Mobilize when you're playing mono-Defenders.

2) Lack of supply to meet the demand. Obviously, I don't have the numbers in front of me, but I suspect Legions was a colossal failure for UDE. My personal feeling is the set is fine, if underpowered, but the general consensus is it had a poor IP, had uninteresting team mechanics, and was non-competitive from a playability standpoint. As such, people probably didn't buy as much Legions as they did XMen. This means more EOMEs were opened than Mobilizes.

3) EOME isn't legal for the upcoming Modern Age, and Mobilize is.

4) Casual players like me love Mobilize. It lets me play an all X-men Mental deck, even though I know staying on-team makes it vastly inferior to, say, the BigSpooky/Barnes version. For any CCG to succeed, there has to be a large installed casual player base. Even though we as a community are a little down on the health of Vs. at the moment, any CCG that can stick around for this long and be considered a Top 5 seller is a success (even though the IP combined with the engine could make it a bigger success than it is). This means there's a large number of casual players out there that probably want Mobilize for their favorite Arkham deck, or their Revenge Squad deck, X-statix deck, etc. But due to #2, these casual players won't have an easy time obtaining them.

Anyway, just my two cents regarding the price of Mobilize. EOME outclasses it, but it's still a great card.

In regards to broken vs. unbroken decks, I think anyone that is familiar with games knows that the standard game is a game of throwing heroes/villains into each other and watching them get stunned. A deck that wins without really interacting with the opponent might be labelled as "broken" by some because they're new and don't know how to handle such a deck. Conversely, a deck that goes to combat for Turns 1-4 and wins might just be really, really good.

I haven't played against this evasion deck, but the reports of 20 minute build turns and the fact it pretty much plays like a game of solitaire doesn't sound like a lot of fun to me. But with EA Mobilize on the line, you should bring anything you can to win. RP may have been meant as a casual format, but as soon as the prize became a rare EA of a highly sought after card, it stopped being casual.

Edit: cleaned up some grammar.

that last post might have taken a half hour to proof read

I am probably a day late and a dollar short here but the fact of the matter is that I just can't keep up as well as I would like and it seems like things have been blazing away on the realms.

I just wanted to chime in and say that I *think* I sort of agree with aces...

I *think* I agree with him because I have some problems parsing his language and ultimately that makes it hard to see his true point so I will say the following.

Yes. EA mobilizes mean win and win big. But I think there were a percentage of players out there, pro and non pro alike, that saw the phrase "random punks" and breathed a sigh of relief. Yes there was still Ahmed and Fateifacts and everything else complex and strong that really is actually common and uncommon but still I think the collective unconscious said to itself "no more 20 minute builds! YA HOOO". No more Ivy and Straight to the Grave nonsense etc. etc. etc.

I would consider myself a "hyper-amateur" or a "semi-pro" but even I was expecting there to be a more laid back feel to the environment. I had friends running LOA/CM and I thought to myself "Hey, Uni-power and Meltdown are useful no matter what and if something like that deck shows up I can do something about it." But in a way, and perhaps this was foolish, there was there aura in the store that there was just a certain level of game that we were not going to have to deal with. Enter some fool with FateSquad.

Now in the end this guy isn't a consistent player or prone to paying attention. So he lost in a horrible way in the semi-finals. But it was still this concept that this somehow laid back environment was tarnished by aggressive overbearing play.

I suppose for some groups who saw Solitare coming that might be the same emotion. Some decks are strong sure, but hey, this is fun right? And then *BAM* you are starting at your opponent getting enough time to make weekend plans before priority even gets handed back to you...

I see this debate on the realms a lot. There are different strata of gamers in this game; competitive, casual, semi-casual and I am sure we all know the super aggro must win at all cost types. And for each of us that fall into a different category we feel different things about the things we see.

Is Solitaire broken? Well ,for me, its no Light Show. I am pretty sure it would have died a horrible death in the face of some of the players in my shop. But at the same time I can empathize with a player or a group of players that got frustrated. Especially if as a group they said “lets not have that in our store” and some Johnny Combo walks in off the street and smashes face.

Mobilize was on the line so I agree it should be expected to some degree.

R/D certainly didn’t test this format. They saw something easy to translate from WOW and didn’t think about it past that. Maybe RP should be Modern only from now on and eventually Silver if they put that much forethought into it.

I think the debate on broken decks is hard. I think sometimes, some people, sit down across from a deck and experience a sensation of utter helplessness. “I can honestly think of no way to stop this deck”. Chances are, in most cases, the solution may be as simple or obscure as a random card named Meltdown that I know a lot of us forgot about until last year…I mean really….who wants to blow up a Green Lantern Ring? But some players depending on their desires and interests in the game get frustrated and abused and feel cheated and angry because a solution seems out of reach or against the "atmosphere" of a shop.

The reality is that this is a game based on social interactions and we are as likely to meet people who do things we do not like in this game as we are walking down the aisle of a supermarket. Sometimes our ethics/opinion/morals just don't coincide with another persons. Add that to a game where the ultimate objective is to play and have a winner of some form or variation (no matter how seriously that victory is considered) and you have the room for bruised egos and hurt feelings.

As a community of people discussing this game we are going to encounter views that make no sense. I guess I am just saying try to consider things from someone else’s view point. On the other side of that, take some time to articulate your issues so someone else can understand. And yes your grammar can affect someones opinion of your ability to communicate. Interenet or no, impressions count.

Later,
PD

You know the more I think about it my mantra seems to be simply. There are no casual or competetive formats, meerly casual and competetive players. Saying a format is "casual" or "pro" is a misnomer because someone, somewhere, is going, "Hey, this will be the perfect time to bust out X broken deck idea." And some other guy going to that same tournament is going, "hey, this will be the perfect place to bust out my masterpiece of Janky McJankerson." The problems arise when those two worlds collide.

What is this DECK that everyone is talking about? I'm lost.

When are you not lost? j/k witcha, bro. follow the link below. It's in the first post.

http://www.vsrealms.com/forum/showthread.php?t=51707

Keep in mind that the entire argument has never really been about how "broken" the deck is, but how it may have been inappropriate for the perceived atmosphere of the event. Aces just can't seem to stop throwing around that particular term.

Yea thats a really good deck but it's not broken by any means. Maybe Aces will calm down and we can get some planning done for future events.

Agreed. He's a good guy, but man he just lost it on here.