That was awesome!

But you can extrapolate what powers Legolas or even the Star Trek ships might have, because in their respective source material, Legolas and the Star Trek ships actually do something.

The problem with the Yu-Gi-Oh monsters is that, even in the source material, whether it's in the game or the manga or the shows, they don't actually do anything. Sure, they stand around a looking awesome, and can wipe out opponent monsters in a single blast, but that's about it.

So what kind of dial would you come up with for someone like, say Summoned Skull (classic Yu-Gi-Oh monster)? Sure, he's got armour and wings, so there's that. But what else you give him? Would he have any range? Super Strength? Battle Fury? Hypersonic Speed?

The problem is that, with absolutely nothing to go on, they'd just be spitballing here. We have no idea how this character would play, what his fighting style is. The game designers would have to pull this 100% out of their ###.

I'm hoping for figures of the human characters from the show (just the first one cuz it had magic) with powers that represent cards in their decks and the magical items they possess.

Like Yami would have prob control cuz he wins 99.99999999999999% of the time. And Pegasus would have something to represent his Millennium Eye.

This was my problem with LotR clix. Sure, the LotR guys do stuff, but determining relative power levels is essentially arbitrary.

Who is definitively a better archer, Green Arrow or Legolas?

Is Gandalf definitively a more powerful wizard than the Ancient One?

Answer: Whatever the game designer decides.

I think the main problem I have is the homogeneity that comes with using the same power set interchangeably for every expansion.

To be fair, though, that is a problem with super-hero-based Heroclix as well. Game designers will arbitrarily make up numbers based upon runs from writer A or writer B, but ignoring runs by writers, C, D, E, and F. I don't believe for a second that DC & Marvel clix are any less arbitrary than Lord of the Ring clix.

The other months I looked at had similar numbers. Didn't seem to matter when, Heroclix was pasted on the top of the chart. I just used this list since I don't know where to find yearly reports for multiple distributors, but I know where to find these lists. Sorry.

Month didn't seem to matter, Heroclix has enough product being ordered/preordered that it secures several top spots in each of these lists I've seen.


I totally get the point about other distributors for products, but a look at Diamond, who is a huge distributor for comic stores, seems relevant to this conversation. It's not all the facts, it just provides some perspective on what one distributor gets the most orders for.

Eh, maybe not, but there are some absolutes there. Or there used to be.

Its not relevent because Diamond is the #1 (and only) distributor of Heroclix. Diamond may not be the #1 distributor of any other game on that list. Therefore comparing Heroclix to any other game that Diamond isn't the sole distributor of isn't an equal comparison.

since they will most likely use the more notable monsters such as dark magician, they will probably use the cards that are usually associated with them.

like... dark magician casts spells, specifically blasts of dark magic/energy, so he will have a range. he has the trap card "magical hats" which in the theme of the game, lets him dodge attacks, so he will have super senses.

he has "dark magic attack" as a spell that lets him destroy the magic/trap cards, so he may have outwit. mystic box which lets him perform a "magic trick" so it could be perplex.

other cards that are newer like "red dragon archfiend" has an effect that if it attacks a defense monster, it destroys all your opponent's defense monsters. thus it could have a power/trait that it either ignores defense powers when it attacks, or gives it the ability to outwit but only defense abilities.

if they use characters... it will most likely be them doing something random.. but let them place pogs of the monsters they summon. much like chanos with the stone golem thing, or the spider man prime (can't remember name) that lets you place the pog.

Yes, absolutely. I agree that YGO is even worse than those in the representation aspect. Even things like movement value and range hardly have a hint on the game/anime to create clix from, and few creatures have more than 1 effect to create special powers (many don't have any).
But I will wait to see what exactly is the release to actually criticize this though - we don't even know if it will be clix of the monsters or of the card players from the anime. The later would have different problems, for example.

But if the problem is "how do we represent the aspects of traps/single-attack battles/hidden cards", the answer is "HeroClix is a terrible system to represent this". It is essentially the problem with all other properties, except now you have to represent another game's rules in the rules (well, some videogame properties had similar problems, but not as much - in YGO, part of the story is the rules).

DISCLAIMER: I have no idea what this release will entail. The following is based on other expansion properties thus far.

I definitely agree, at base. One of my issues with expansion properties is that compatibility is first and foremost, which causes any sort of uniqueness or distinction (aside from sculpt) to take a backseat.

This is not necessarily true.
In the anime, a large number of the most commonly used monsters have cards based off of the fact that showed up in Ancient Egypt. Like... Dark Magician was a mage who served the Pharoah and definitely does have a back story.

The best way for WizKids to approach this is to design monsters based on the attacks they use, their back stories, and the cards designed to support them. Dark Magician, for example, has a variety of spells that affect him in Yu-Gi-Oh and could be implemented into a figure based around him. He uses Magical Hats to redirects attacks at other people. Brain Control is commonly used to control opposing monsters. Summoned Skull could use Spellbinding Circle as a form of incapacitate, etc, etc.

After you've selected the posts you want to multi-quote this way, click New Reply.

It's still relevant. Ignore Heroclix, and look at the other products on the list.

Board games beat the heck out of Yugioh. Is Diamond the only distributor of board games? I suspect not. M:TG only shows up on the list once, but at #8, while Yugioh is at slots 18 and 21. That looks like Magic is doing about as well, if not better, than Yugioh.

If Diamond's sales are in the ballpark of other distributors' sales, then the likelihood that Yugioh makes up 70% of most stores' sales is is pretty darn low. I wouldn't say it looks likely that Yugioh is ahead of the combined sales Magic and board games (let alone when you include Heroclix), as KingoftheSwamp claimed.

But hey, maybe just looking at one month isn't enough. Let's look at Diamond's top 50 game products for all of 2012. No presence from Yugioh in the top 50 products of the year. Huh.


Now Diamond isn't the be-all end-all of distribution, but to dismiss it as irrelevant? That's just an asinine determination. It's still a major distributor, ya know? Hopefully this helps you understand how it's relevant. If you have sales figures for other distribution companies, feel free to add them to the discussion; I'm just using Diamond because their charts are easy to find and they're a well known company in collectible circles.

The other products don't matter because we don't know how large of a distributor Diamond is for those products compared to other distributors. Diamond may be the lowest selling distributor of Magic and YuGiOh for all we know.

I know my local venue only buys Heroclix/Comics/Toys from Diamond. All other games he gets from a local distributor.