Really? we've been given them to the own in the regular league to the best of my knowledge

And if not SA's, they'd both be DFDs. The first stopped DawnStar from using her HSS-lite, and/or attacking, and the 2nd just stopped Superman from attacking as well.

I'm fairly sure we had this discussion in L-1 as well. TAK was rather disappointed

And again, Barrier has to stop all attacks, not just one. So, as Superboy was able to attack in his last turn, there's no DFD. And I don't think I've ever seen incap used as DFDs before...

Incap has never been used as a DFD because it's always a SA.

We'd given a DFD if you outwitted HSS... because it stops an attack

Both Barriers/Incap have stopped a character with a move and attack power from being able to make an attack to everyone on the entire field

Thus a DFD

Great move with the extension of range with CP.

1) Cosmic Boy TK's Batman to Q17.
Free: Batman Outwits Lex's Mastermind.
Free: Batman Perplexes up his own movement to 11 so he can charge 6.
2) Batman charges 6 to W20 and makes a close combat attack on Lex.
Roll is (2,5) with the LO that's 3 damage.
3) Dawnstar Breakaway with a 4 Dawnstar retreats to U23.

Batman 1SA, 1AST
Cosmic Boy 1 AST

Everyone copies Batman TA for all the good it does some of them

TMNT99's Darkseid’s Society (Home)

1) R Angle Man (Icicle; 5/6) W-15@@
2) U Lex Luthor* (2/5)
* w/ Contingency Plan
3) R Killer Moth (Lex Corp Battlesuit) W-17
4) R Gorilla Grodd (3/7) S-22@@
5) R Captain Cold X-13
6) R Funky Flashman (Street Thug) X-15

vs.

Superclone's Legion of Superheroes (Visitor)

1) R Superman 100 (6/7) J12
[1 SA]
2) E Cosmic Boy 70 (6/6) I9 @@
[2 AST]
3) R Batman 64 (6/6) W20 @
[1 SA][1 AST]
4) E Dawnstar 60 (4/6) U23 @

HO: V-18, I-12, S22
LO: V-19, F-11


Special Object: 23) Telephone Booth (LO) -- A character occupying the same squares as this object can be dealt 1 pushing damage as a free action. - O-10

BFC: Fearless Assault

Map: Xavier’s Mansion (Outdoor)

http://www.ianparmenter.com/hcutils/...5&u4=x-220y209

Sorry, Lex outwitted your HSS power with his TA that he's granted from being next to Killer Moth

Ah I screwed up the names. I thought Tracker was the name of the power that is actually named Quarry. Mea culpa. I will need to adjust. That's unfortunate.

I've updated the post and the map with Luthor on the board. Wish I hadn't made that mistake as I wouldn't have moved Batman like that.

Ah well, such is the way with PBE games.

We can bring it up in the thread, but Barrier = DFD only when all attacks are blocked. Incap = No DFD. That bit's irrefutable. An exception may be made, possibly cause it's not -truly- Incap. but I'm not the final say on this, the League is. If you get overwhelming support, you get it. If not, it's up to me and Glen.

As the person who literally developed the system....

Icap is given was not given a DFD as it was awarded a SA, an no one action is given two STATs.

Barrier is given a DFD when it prevents teammates from being attacked. We give DFD's to folks who outwit a power like charge when it stops someone.

In this case I've done exactly that, but my barrier/incap I've stoped both Superman and DawnStar from hitting everyone on my team.

One last thing, Batman doesn't get an AST for outwitting MM when he does the attack..

And I don't think he'd get the AST, because outwitting MM doesn't make an attack possible, as an attack would occur eithr way.

Lex outwits Batman's outwit

Killer Moth flies to W-14 and puts Lex in X-14, takes a push

CP up Funky's attack.

Funky draws a gun an tries to hit Batman. Av8 (+1 for CP) vs dv17, need an 8, roll is 4+3 for 7, so close

1 Token to CP

Lex will MM to Killer Moth, AngleMan to Killer Moth as well. If Killer Moth bites it, I'll MM to Funky.


TMNT99's Darkseid’s Society (Home)

1) R Angle Man (Icicle; 5/6) W-15
2) U Lex Luthor* (2/5) X-14
* w/ Contingency Plan (1 Token)
3) R Killer Moth (Lex Corp Battlesuit; 3/4) W-14@@
4) R Gorilla Grodd (3/7) S-22
5) R Captain Cold X-13
6) R Funky Flashman (Street Thug) X-15@

vs.

Superclone's Legion of Superheroes (Visitor)

1) R Superman 100 (6/7) J12
[1 SA]
2) E Cosmic Boy 70 (6/6) I9 @@
[2 AST]
3) R Batman 64 (6/6) W20 @
[1 SA][1 AST]
4) E Dawnstar 60 (4/6) U23 @

HO: V-18, I-12, S22
LO: V-19, F-11


Special Object: 23) Telephone Booth (LO) -- A character occupying the same squares as this object can be dealt 1 pushing damage as a free action. - O-10

BFC: Fearless Assault

Map: Xavier’s Mansion (Outdoor)

http://www.ianparmenter.com/hcutils/...5&u4=x-220y209

Yes, you are correct. The AST was left over from Dawnstar's mistaken attempt at an attack, thanks for catching that.

Ugh ... now I *have* to fight my way through all of those MM fodder. Ugh.

1 Token to CP

Funniest sentence ever written in an online league, or perhaps anywhere.

Cos' Leadership cannot do anything for me, so we'll ignore it for now I guess.

1) Batman, tries to recover. Charge on Grodd, picking up the HO on the way from V18. Charges to T23, yanks the object from under Grodd when he arrives and tries to hit with an AV 9 on DV 13. Just hits with a 5. Whew, Grodd is KO'd.
2) Superman is now free. He cannot see Funky, but he has a clear shot at Angle Man. AV 10 on DV 17. (an incomplete edited roll of 6,4 happened because of my son :-) Too bad, it was a nice roll.)
Heh ... a 3 with a (2,1), figures.

Cos and Dawnstar clear.

TMNT99's Darkseid’s Society (Home)

1) R Angle Man (Icicle; 5/6) W-15
2) U Lex Luthor* (2/5) X-14
* w/ Contingency Plan (1 Token)
3) R Killer Moth (Lex Corp Battlesuit; 3/4) W-14@@
4) R Gorilla Grodd
5) R Captain Cold X-13
6) R Funky Flashman (Street Thug) X-15@

vs.

Superclone's Legion of Superheroes (Visitor)

1) R Superman 100 (6/7) J12 @
[1 SA]
2) E Cosmic Boy 70 (6/6) I9
[2 AST]
3) R Batman 64 (5/6) W20 @@
[2 SA][1 KO]
4) E Dawnstar 60 (4/6) U23

HO: V-18, I-12
LO: V-19, F-11


Special Object: 23) Telephone Booth (LO) -- A character occupying the same squares as this object can be dealt 1 pushing damage as a free action. - O-10

BFC: Fearless Assault

Map: Xavier’s Mansion (Outdoor)

http://www.ianparmenter.com/hcutils/...66&u4=x-94y124

OWing Charge, preventing a single fig from attacking everyone on your team, IS enough to warrant a DFD.

However, I vividly recall from last season when I ran a triple/quadruple barrier team, that the same requirement does not hold for barrier. To get a DFD from barrier, one must prevent EVERY enemy from attacking EVERY ally. It obviously makes it much more difficult, but I think the prevaling reasoning is that it was otherwise much too easy to get DFDs with barrier.

I dunno though, I feel as though Icicles should give you something, because it is not always easy to position it such that you get 3 barrier tokens near an enemy. This situation might need its own rule, because it is pretty unique.

As the opponent, even I would advocate for this. I think that this ability is tricky to use (having used it many times myself) and should give something to the user. This isn't just throwing up a barrier, it requires some thought and sometimes some careful planning (such as using 2 CP tokens) in order to get it to do anything.

I think Copsicles should have some kind of unique rule where it gives the same as Incapacitate.

I don't have a problem with it giving something, but yes, it'd have to be it's own rule, as there's no other precedent for this kind of power. As the two composite powers exist, neither would grant a DFD.

So again, I'm not against I'm fine with awarding a DFD, I'm just saying as the rules stand, no DFD.

I find this funny... as the person you should ultimately consult of what counts... is me, who developed the system.

This is the exact same instance as outwitting someone with a single move and attack power. They are stuck in place, unable to attack, anyone, instead of being able to go nearly anywhere on the map and have their choice of figure. I have defended my entire team from taking damage.