not disagreeing with me, rather than the way they disagree. instead of saying "well thats a good point, however...." everyone basically says "get over it, im happy with it and thats all that matters"
your last line is exactly what im trying to say.

If the people you play with are universally using the same strategy because of Print and Play, I'd suggest talking with them. Let them know what you're looking for in a game. It can't hurt to communicate.

Well, not everyone has the piece they need. LE clixs are still LEs, quality older figures are still hard to find, and SRs are always SRs.

Just because a Pawn gets an uzi doesn't automatically mean it can become the Queen. A feated-up Swamp Thing is still Swamp Thing.

If anything the game just got a lot tougher, who knows what squirrel combination you'll see out of your opponents now.

And even after a year long break, the game is still strong.

oh i do and have now become the black sheep. i dont have a problem with print and play i guess. its the constant team building of min/max teams now all being thunderbolted or using fortitude.

Ok, you're not a min/max'er. Kudos to you. Everyone has fun in their own way, and you should be applauded for how you choose to approach the game. The issue with this argument, however, is that at the highest competitive level, everyone is a min/max'er. I mentioned this in another thread, but I read an article a couple of years ago that listed the most-often used Heroclix in a given tournament. The top three consisted of Protected, Fortitude, and either In Contact with Oracle or Warbound. The fact that the top three most often used Heroclix were cardboard should tell you that people will use/over-use/abuse cards no matter what the situation is. All this does is make it so everyone has the opportunity to use game elements that they otherwise wouldn't be able to. Even with the easily available feats, people still have to collect what are supposed to be the main gameplay elements: Heroclix, so you will still see variety dependent upon each person's own collection.

now this is how you disagree with someone while still being respectful. thank you and reps a comin'

since game is dead, can I have your stuff?

I don't see how this is more boring. Players may now use any feat or BFC in the game. Unless your team is prepared for every scenario, you can still be surprised. There's actually an even greater chance of throwing off your opponents now since we have every feat/bfc available to us.

You like being surprised because Tim is playing warbound and you didn't know he had it? Now you'll never know what he has until he reveals his team. It could include any cardboard element in the game! Boredom averted!


The game is still primarily about the figures, not the cardboard, by the way. Take your unpredictability factor from the figures, if it helps. Hopefully you can still enjoy the game even with "print and play."

I do see that, I mean, I love collecting games. There is little joy as interesting and fun as sitting down with a new box of cards and cracking into it. Or the mystery of seeing what's in a fresh pack of cards/clix.

But over time, lets face it, the joy of collecting has faded a little. As CCGs and Minis have become something less than the newest-fad, the excitement and mystery have subsided. I don't buy single packs of Magic and piecemeal decks together from the boxes of hodgepodge like I did in High School. I don't have a great deal of pride in my collection like I did back when I used to have to scrimp and save for every bit of my Star Wars collection.

Now I just buy a dang case of the set and pull 90% of it in one swoop.. and THEN I buy what I'm missing in the most cost-effective way possible. Its not about hunting or collecting, its just business. I want to have all of the possible options to play with at my disposal, and I want them ASAP.

And the hunt is cool, I agree. I remember how feverishly I hunted down each issue of Marvel's Akira GN's back when they had colorized them. Those were pretty obscure books, especially after the four year hiatus, and having the grab them all from Cons in Kansas, it took me about six cons to finally collect all 38 issues. And everyone was a major, MAJOR excitement. And then I had them all, and the thrill was gone.

But time has passed and, lets face it, there really is no hunt anymore. If I want anything, I can go to ebay at any moment of any day, type in Akira or what have you, and there it is. Five or six or even a hundred of anything at any time. There is literally no challenge or sport to finding anything that exists for this game. Every piece you ever wanted is on ebay (except that one Wolverine piece). the only thing it takes is money.

And now in that same passage of time, I look at my other gamers, especially the younger ones, with a bit of sympathy. A lot of our Clixers are in High School or College. A lot of them work part time, have rent to pay. Sure, they don't have the debts and house payment that the older guys have, but they only make $7 per hour and have to eat off of that. Think of that, one pack of clix is two hours of labor for a lot of our player base our there. They don't have a lot of disposable income to throw down (especially if they plan on getting girlfriends). Yet they play and collect because they love it.

But one of the things I have NEVER enjoyed collecting in this game is the cardboard. The figures are the center of the game, and the cardboard is just something to highlight them. Heck, they don't even have a rarity level. So I have really hated how some players have just collected massive amounts of old, essentially UC cardboard pieces, and now all my fellow players have to drop $20, 3 hours of hard earned income, on a square of cardboard. On an accessory.

Hindsight has taught me that a game is more fun and the environment healthier if everyone has access to as much as possible. Let the junior players have free cardboard. Is that really what you were collecting anyway? Suddenly, they can play alongside you at tournaments, and their limited figure supply can do everything it was supposed to do.

You, meanwhile, Mr. Collector, can still enjoy the hunt of getting all those plastic LE men and Marquis Victor Creeds and whatever Con Exclusives may come in the future.

Oh... what's that? Do you hear something? Why yes, its a reclusive World's Finest. Oh, and a beautiful 500 pointer at that. Do you see it? Its hiding in the Ebay over there. Here's $50, fire away.

It is sad that regardless of a person's view point it can be deemed as wrong just because not everyone agrees with it. If the person does not like something and can give a correct reason about why they don't like it then they have a valid point. Just like how people who do like it have a correct reason and making their valid point.

You could either agree or disagree, but no matter how you say it you should not end it snidely such as it happened get over it, stop crying, if you don't like it quit the game. Most of these remarks are not made in jest, not made to provoke thoughtful discussion but more of a flame war.

^ a bit wordy but agreed.

Cardboard should have never been as important and vital to the game as it was before, this has solved that problem. The biggest impact is the major tourney scene, it puts more people on an even playing field, which means more competetion, regardless of expendable income, which isn't a bad thing.

Plus...kill the game, where have you been for the last year buddy?

(the preceding was in response to the guy with Power Girls giant...well, but phantalien had to go and make me look lazy.)

How would that kill the game? The game was just fine before feat cards were even added.

And really, I love the print and play concept. I think it evens the playing field by giving everyone access to the same cards.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to tom730 again.

Maybe flame war is a little strong.

I am just finding it hard to believe that after a year without clix we have so many issues with print and play. Admittedly the only feat that I put a lot of time/money into getting was War Bound, but I haven't seen a drop on prices on the feats so far. If this is such a big issue, encourage your venue to ignore the print and play ruling and find the feats as needed.

I am hoping to find some of the older feats now, as I prefer having the card on cardboard printed properly. If anything I want the originals more now