I've been saying it for years. PayPal are thieves.

Oh yeah, I've always known that. Funny how they are owned by E-Bay, so they are 'double dipping' so to speak. E-Bay charges you the fees to list/sell on their site, and then Pay Pal charges you their fees to get paid for selling said items on E-Bay. What a racket.

No wonder the guy who started E-Bay is a billionaire now.

Don't forget the arbitrage - The wonderful rate that paypal charges for converting $USD to $CDN (That extra 1-2% doesn't hurt their bottom line either).

Add the fact that as Canadians - Ebay bills us in Canadian Dollars (yet requests to sell in US dollars) so they make the exchange there too.

Then the fact that despite having a US dollar account at the bank (here in Canada), it is REQUIRED to use and channel money through a Canadian Dollar account.

And Don't look now, but Ebay has increased (hidden the increases) in their new ststem - the only significant positive change is "Free" auction listings. Free as in list at .99 or less start - no upfront fee. However if it sells at .99- here are your costs - (10% FVF) thats .90, paypal fees (minimum .40), down to .50
from the .50 you have cost of item, time to list package and travel to PO.

When Ebay/paypal makes more money than you on a transaction it is time to rethink and re-evaluate.

On the rare occasions that I sell clix online*, I would always do so here rather than on eBay.


* Thinking about selling some UK exclusive IndyClix, actually.

I shall join in the rant...

Rabble rabble rant rant! Rabble rant rant spew!

I hope that everything gets cleared up.

Oh, I have been saying its waaaaaaay past that time for a while now. I'm not saying I told you so either. I'm saying I really do not understand why people blindly keep putting up with it. To quote a favorite movie line, "There is only so much #### up with which I will put". Evidently, most people's levels are much higher than mine.


I, too, hope everything is resolved in a positive manner for the OP.

Why do people blindly put up with it? Easy when its the "only" game in town you have 2 choices - a) Adapt and play the game, b) quit/ try to find another game. When there is not many other alternatives that will give the market size that ebay can reach it doesn't give you much choice.

Similarily to banking, insurance, cell phone carriers or gasoline prices - there are a certain amount of market players - "they" decide the rules and if you want to play the choices are limited a) Adapt and play the game (find the best deal you can) or b) quit/ try to find another game.

Live without Ebay to sell goods is possible (use craigslist or other alternatives, create your own online, etc)

Live without gasoline (ride a bus, bicycle, work from home),
Live without banking (put your money in a mattress, use cash stop business -licenced loan sharks, operate a cash business)
Live without insurance (your own risk)
Live without cellphones - haha - this business has mimiced ebay practices- lets give you something for free (ie texting introduction) and then start charging for it, give you a "free" phone on a fixed "plan" for a locked in period of time.

There is no doubt that between a horrible global recession and ebay's growing fees structure that it is not as profitable as it once was, however until a realistic alternative becomes available - it will still be our primary choice for buying and selling both common and unusual items.

Guess our tolerance of #### is higher than yours machineman, however that does not make us a big fan of ebay, just a lot more prudent in our selections

Glad I no longer work there.

Really sorry to hear this W.I.T.
If only that bidder from brazil would have stopped bidding a few bucks cheaper, then the 700 lot could have stayed in canada.

You always have a choice. You make it much harder than it has to be, its simple here, either choose to get screwed or not.But I understand what you say. Its hard to let go when you've relied on this source for your goals for such a long time. But when your source goes through so many unfair changes you can go with it or wait for something better. If everyone keeps "waiting" and still uses this source, then nothing new will come. Change for the better will never happen. Don't get me wrong, I still use E-Bay, but I only buy from folks who will accept another form of payment besides PayPal. That leaves me with limited buying choices, and also cuts me out of selling there anymore or sure. But I choose it and am very happy with my choice. Sometimes you gotta just let go. But I understand not everyone can just let go. You and others have more at stake in letting go than I ever will. I would love to be holding auctions again, but I can wait for something else to emerge. Its just gonna be a longer wait when everybody else is still putting up with the questionable tactics of e-bay and its subsidiaries.

Ebay and Paypal are a joke. It used to suck to be a buyer (I once got kicked off Ebay for sending a M.O. to a guy in Canada from the southern US during Christas. He reported that I didn't pay after 4 days when it took at least a week to get there. I had the number for the M.O. but it didn't matter and to boot the guy recieved and kept the M.O.) Now the buyers have more rights, but they took all the rights away as sellers. It's a joke that if you have a horrible transaction with someone, as long as they pay, you can't leave any kind of feedback other than positive.

I had two come up recently where I am now not going to be selling on Ebay for awhile. The first was one where I sold a lot of figures and something happened (allegedly) and the guy got an empty box that had been damaged during shipping. I had insurance on it and the buyer could have filed to get his money back. He refused to and actually tried to send the box back to me to further damage it so I couldn't get the insurance claim either.

The second is one that still amazes me. The guy got the figures and then tried to claim I was selling fake figures. He said something about the dials not looking right and that I had obviousely created them. Ebay luckily saw through that one and sided with me, but still it's enough to make me gun-shy about selling on Ebay for awhile.

It all comes down to a simple truth:

People suck but we'd all be talking to ourselves without them!

In MY past experiences, having a tracking number and insurance usually wins over with Paypal. If you used the eBay message system to tell him it would take a long time to reach him, then you're even further ahead as there's proof that he was informed and agreed.

I recently lost out because (I assume) a package was stolen from my doorstep, but as soon as the seller provided them the tracking number saying that it was delivered, the case was closed. Even though I told them that in the first place... I talked to the post office and mailman, but nothing ever came of it.

Thankfully though I was only out like 15 bucks.

On the insurance one;
You put the insurance in the package.
You are the one that has to make the claim.
The buyer cannot make the claim.
Happened to me.(as a buyer)
Offering insurance to a buyer is bogus.
Tracking #s can be a dead end for the buyer as well.
There has to be a box that is delivered with the # and that's all.
It doesn't have to verify what's in it.
There are a lot of crooked people out there.
And one more; I had a package track to my post office and that's where it ended.
the seller refunded my money with no claim filed with PP.
I don't know if the seller filed claim with the post office.
Now that sucks, period.

Actually, according to the USPS, the sender or receiver can either one file the claim. What they told me was that as part of the claim investigation, they would need to examine the damaged box, which seemed appropriate. I asked the buyer to file the claim since they allowed him to and he needed to take the box to them anyways. He refused to and threatened to damage the box further by just resending it to me. I eventually filed the claim myself after about 4 months of him not being reasonable. Maybe I'm looking at it the wrong way, but if something happens to a box during shipping, I'm going to probably blame the place that actually damaged it rather than just the guy who sent it.