That rule from page 7 was just what I was looking for, though it still doesn't make clear that Darkseid's buddy's action should be allowed later in a turn, it does make it clear that a running shot needs to be taken as part of the action. I am reading at Vanisher Punisher, that since this action is being allowed as part of Darkseid's power, it has to be taken as part of using the power as the "game effects this action allows." Yes, normally a character can not take a non-free action during another character's action but this action allows it just like you can't normally take a free action during another character's action unless the power allows it.

Nuadha, I'm sorry man, but this is not how his power works. He is not giving the other character an action or a free action. Running shot states that the character is given a ranged attack as a free action. Darkseid states that the character is allowed to take a non-free action if it was carried by him this turn. His power is only countering the portion of carry which states that carried characters cannot be given non-free actions. The non-free action is not generated by Boom Tube Invasion where as the ranged attack from Running Shot is generated by Running Shot. Boom Tube Invasion is just allowing something to happen, it in of itself is not making said event happen.

Does that clear it up for you?

It's just the wording of the powers, but I can kinda see Nuadha's point.

Not saying that this is how it is actually played, but that I can understand his argument. It does read in a similar manner.

Not really, since by that logic, Running Shot does not give an action to a character either but allows you to take a ranged combat action as a free action. It merely counters the fact that a ranged combat action is usually a non-free action.

"Nuadha, I'm sorry man, but this is not how his power works."

No need to apologize to me. I don't have an interest in it working one way or another. In fact, I am big Fourth World fan, so I want it to be as good as possible as I plan to field a Darkseid myself one day. I don't have one yet, or I would probably use him this weekend myself. I just want to know why it works that way and Running Shot does not. Every argument that allows Darkseid's buddy to take the action later in the turn could just as easily be applied to Running Shot.

We all accept that Running Shot does not work that way, so I would really like to know why everyone accepts that Darkseid's power works differently. The only thing that references "this turn" refers to who may take the action that turn, but not when the action should be taken. As I see it, there is nothing in the wording that makes it different than the wording of Running Shot.

Thanks. I'm not saying I think it works that way either. I don't know and it seems most people believe it should allow the action taken later in the turn. I just want to know what in the wording would clue you in to it working differently. Most of the powers allow you to bend the rules while taking that action. Any powers whose effects lingers will usually say something like "until the beginning of your next turn" or "until the end of your turn." This one says neither, but most people seem to say it works that way. I'd like to know why.

The biggest difference is that running shot grants an action, boom-tube invasion does not. The ranged combat action in running shot is granted by and part of the power action that you used to activate running shot. Boom-tube invasion is not granting the use of an action, but instead allowing a character who meets the criteria to take an action it normally couldn't.

^^ This

You are getting caught up on the wrong points. Running Shot is giving a specific action. Boom Tube Invasion is simply stating that one can happen.

I would just say that the key difference is in the sentence structure. With RS and Charge, the move and attack are all part of the same sentence. With BtI, there are two separate sentences. Is that sufficient enough to justify the difference? I don't know. But it is a huge difference (in the context of HC).

I'm afraid that doesn't clear it up for me. Why would it being a separate sentence that says you may do something change what it is allowing. Either power would be allowing an action. Neither power specifies when it is taken. (I am not referring to Charge since it does specifically say when the action is taken by saying "then." Neither power says the power is giving an action, so by the letter of the law nether power is covered under page 7. Both say they are allowing an action when an action would not have been legal. Running shot says "...and it may be given a ranged combat action as a free action." Is it because the power is being allowed to another character?

Again, I am not trying to be difficult. I am really trying to understand. If I had not seen a bunch of folks talking about how it allows the attack to be taken later here on the forums, my first assumption would be that it would be treated like any other power that says "may" take an action, but it is being treated differently. I get what some folks are saying here that it allows an action that was not normally legal to be legally taken, but isn't that true of all those powers?

Just for the sake of playing the devil's advocate, Mind Control is worded in a very similar manner and the actions are broken down into individual sentences much like Darkseid's power:

Mind Control: Give this character a power action; it makes a close combat or ranged combat attack (minimum range value 4) as a free action that deals no damage. A successfully hit target becomes friendly to your force. Each target hit may be assigned one action as a free action, immediately after which the target becomes an opposing character again. Deal this character 1 unavoidable damage for each 100 points of the successfully hit targets’ combined point value.

Why is it assumed that Darkseid's power is done at any point in the turn but the effects of Mind Control happen immediately?

If I must I must:

Notice with running shot it states in one sentence to move the character and then possibly give the character a ranged combat action as a free action. It is specifically telling you what to do as part of the movement. It is in one sentence and the previously quoted rule from page 7 takes effect. It must happen then.

Now with Boom Tube Invasion notice that it states then when Darkseid uses P/T he can carry three characters. That means that he can only carry when he uses P/T. Then in a separate sentence it states that a character who was carried by Darkseid this turn may be given a non-free action. Due to where the period is this is basically a separate power. This is similar to characters who have two powers together in one Special Power.

This is the answer. If you still don't like the explanation then I'm sorry, but I cannot do anything further for you and you will have to simply except it as something that just is.

Because MC grants the actions, they happen immediately because they are a part of the larger action. BtI is an action and then it is over. It doesn't grant anything, but it allows something to occur that would ordinarily be illegal.

See above post for argument

By the "separate sentence argument," You could attack, make the figure friendly to your force, and then never use the free action. He would never return to the opposing player, since he only returns after the free action is taken!

Fin. stupid limit on letters