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To clarify, you can take more than one free action, but you can't do the same thing with a free action more than once in a given turn. You can't Outwit twice, nor may you make a close combat attack as a free action twice. However, you CAN (such as with Galactus's Herald) make a close combat attack as a free action— say, during HSS— and then use give that character a close combat action.
Further, note that three (off the top of my head) exceptions exist. The first is the free action given to a wild card to copy team abilities. The second is the free actions granted by Multiattack. The third is GG Thing's Had Enough Clobberin' Yet? special power. The key is that the free action's rules must explicitly state that it can be given multiple times.
Can you walk and chew gum? I can
Can you run, swim, and ride a bike? I can
There is nothing about the conjunctioin "and" that necessitates they happen at the same time or that one can not be done without the other.
The conjunction "and" just puts all options before you. The conjunction "or" in many contexts will function exactly the same as "and" does.
The key words are "can use" that sets the context for either "and" or "or" it sets up the list of powers that you "CAN use" which is why "or" or "and" are interchangeable, or perhaps I should say that is why "or" and "and" are interchangeable. Sometimes it simply makes no difference what conjunction you use to hook up your words and phrases and clauses.
This is absolutely incorrect. Im surprised you guys can actually play a full match without knowing the significance in the wording of specials. Whiz kids actually corrects erratas. By replacing the word and/or. Ex. From the 5thand anniversary avengers se
Red skulls special reads paraphrased: red skull can use perplex, outwit or probability control. After actions resolve roll a d6. 1-3 he takes an unavoidable damage. After reviewing how weak this special was and the risk not out weighing the reward, they produced a correction. The ONLY thing they changed was OR to AND. now that unavoidable damage seems to be worth it. The new avengers movie red skull, has the same ability and includes the AND option. This is not a debate, it is simple fact. In fact its stupid arguments like this that forced whizkids to specify between AND/OR. You read the rules all you want, but the entire purpose of a 'special'chaos is so that a player would have an advantage over a set rule over other players. You can deny this all you want....but it is not up in the air. It has been confirmed. Play by the rules kids or don't play at all.....there are other games!
Can you walk and chew gum? I can
Can you run, swim, and ride a bike? I can
There is nothing about the conjunctioin "and" that necessitates they happen at the same time or that one can not be done without the other.
The conjunction "and" just puts all options before you. The conjunction "or" in many contexts will function exactly the same as "and" does.
Ha ha ha.....I just keep reading this in utter disbelief, how many specials have you negated just for THIS to be correct? How many players have you forced to only choose one option when their ability clearly says AND? Not only is this absolutely wrong, but in order for what you said to be correct, it would end up breaking MORE rules then if you used the subtext of AND/OR correctly. Please, before you argue and retort ....do research and ask tournament leaders. You are incorrect sir, absolutely and comically incorrect.
This is absolutely incorrect. Im surprised you guys can actually play a full match without knowing the significance in the wording of specials. Whiz kids actually corrects erratas. By replacing the word and/or. Ex. From the 5thand anniversary avengers se
Red skulls special reads paraphrased: red skull can use perplex, outwit or probability control. After actions resolve roll a d6. 1-3 he takes an unavoidable damage. After reviewing how weak this special was and the risk not out weighing the reward, they produced a correction. The ONLY thing they changed was OR to AND. now that unavoidable damage seems to be worth it. The new avengers movie red skull, has the same ability and includes the AND option. This is not a debate, it is simple fact. In fact its stupid arguments like this that forced whizkids to specify between AND/OR. You read the rules all you want, but the entire purpose of a 'special'chaos is so that a player would have an advantage over a set rule over other players. You can deny this all you want....but it is not up in the air. It has been confirmed. Play by the rules kids or don't play at all.....there are other games!
Quote : Originally Posted by InfinityWatchReturns
Ha ha ha.....I just keep reading this in utter disbelief, how many specials have you negated just for THIS to be correct? How many players have you forced to only choose one option when their ability clearly says AND? Not only is this absolutely wrong, but in order for what you said to be correct, it would end up breaking MORE rules then if you used the subtext of AND/OR correctly. Please, before you argue and retort ....do research and ask tournament leaders. You are incorrect sir, absolutely and comically incorrect.
The reality is that there are numerous figures with "can use X and Y" who cannot use X and Y at the same time: they have both available but must choose which one to use. And that's because while "and" allows all the options to be available the rules prohibit activating both. Certainly there are "and" combinations where most or all of the options can be chosen ("can use Perplex and Outwit", for example) but there are many others where that is not the case ("can use Hypersonic Speed and Phasing/Teleport").
I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.
“No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife between the shoulder blades will seriously cramp his style.”
This is absolutely incorrect. Im surprised you guys can actually play a full match without knowing the significance in the wording of specials. Whiz kids actually corrects erratas. By replacing the word and/or. Ex. From the 5thand anniversary avengers se
Red skulls special reads paraphrased: red skull can use perplex, outwit or probability control. After actions resolve roll a d6. 1-3 he takes an unavoidable damage. After reviewing how weak this special was and the risk not out weighing the reward, they produced a correction. The ONLY thing they changed was OR to AND. now that unavoidable damage seems to be worth it. The new avengers movie red skull, has the same ability and includes the AND option. This is not a debate, it is simple fact. In fact its stupid arguments like this that forced whizkids to specify between AND/OR. You read the rules all you want, but the entire purpose of a 'special'chaos is so that a player would have an advantage over a set rule over other players. You can deny this all you want....but it is not up in the air. It has been confirmed. Play by the rules kids or don't play at all.....there are other games!
Quote : Originally Posted by InfinityWatchReturns
Ha ha ha.....I just keep reading this in utter disbelief, how many specials have you negated just for THIS to be correct? How many players have you forced to only choose one option when their ability clearly says AND? Not only is this absolutely wrong, but in order for what you said to be correct, it would end up breaking MORE rules then if you used the subtext of AND/OR correctly. Please, before you argue and retort ....do research and ask tournament leaders. You are incorrect sir, absolutely and comically incorrect.
...And this is your brain on drugs. Remember, kids, don't do drugs!
Quote : Originally Posted by DemonRS
Justify to me why this thread is necessary and I'll keep it open..
Quote : Originally Posted by Girathon
It pissed me off all weekend rorschachparadox wasn't dead.
This is absolutely incorrect. Im surprised you guys can actually play a full match without knowing the significance in the wording of specials. Whiz kids actually corrects erratas. By replacing the word and/or. Ex. From the 5thand anniversary avengers se
Red skulls special reads paraphrased: red skull can use perplex, outwit or probability control. After actions resolve roll a d6. 1-3 he takes an unavoidable damage. After reviewing how weak this special was and the risk not out weighing the reward, they produced a correction. The ONLY thing they changed was OR to AND. now that unavoidable damage seems to be worth it. The new avengers movie red skull, has the same ability and includes the AND option. This is not a debate, it is simple fact. In fact its stupid arguments like this that forced whizkids to specify between AND/OR. You read the rules all you want, but the entire purpose of a 'special'chaos is so that a player would have an advantage over a set rule over other players. You can deny this all you want....but it is not up in the air. It has been confirmed. Play by the rules kids or don't play at all.....there are other games!
Quote : Originally Posted by InfinityWatchReturns
Ha ha ha.....I just keep reading this in utter disbelief, how many specials have you negated just for THIS to be correct? How many players have you forced to only choose one option when their ability clearly says AND? Not only is this absolutely wrong, but in order for what you said to be correct, it would end up breaking MORE rules then if you used the subtext of AND/OR correctly. Please, before you argue and retort ....do research and ask tournament leaders. You are incorrect sir, absolutely and comically incorrect.
There was really no need to raise this thread which had gone dormant for three weeks in order to provide incorrectness in a very rude manner where the correct answer had already been given.
IceHot was and is 100% correct. I'm not sure what you think was confirmed, but I'm here to provide the conformation that IceHot is correct.
There was really no need to raise this thread which had gone dormant for three weeks in order to provide incorrectness in a very rude manner where the correct answer had already been given.
IceHot was and is 100% correct. I'm not sure what you think was confirmed, but I'm here to provide the conformation that IceHot is correct.
Just gonna ask one question: "character must be within range AND line of sight etc etc" so do you guys believe that they mean OR EITHER OR, CHOOSE ONE, or perhaps and refers to AND IN ADDITION TO. I think its silly, this forum has the same credentials as wikipedia. Someone ask a question, and a random player answers. People believe since it was blogged about on hcrealms....it is legit. AND- IN ADDITION TO. OR-EITHER OR. it has already been confirmed, now continue playing the game wrong kiddies.
When a special states: you may AND you may. Guess what? As long as you do not break one of the three golden rules of heroclix, then you absolutely MAY perform that special. The entire point of a special is to give a player 'special' privlages over set rules other players must follow.
Just gonna ask one question: "character must be within range AND line of sight etc etc" so do you guys believe that they mean OR EITHER OR, CHOOSE ONE, or perhaps and refers to AND IN ADDITION TO. I think its silly, this forum has the same credentials as wikipedia. Someone ask a question, and a random player answers. People believe since it was blogged about on hcrealms....it is legit. AND- IN ADDITION TO. OR-EITHER OR. it has already been confirmed, now continue playing the game wrong kiddies.
Wow. I'm still not sure what you think has been "confirmed", since your communication style rambles. But you've got a rules Deputy, one of the people WizKids has designated to provide correct and official answers, telling you you're wrong, and you're going to argue that he's some random player and you have the right answer? That's....wow.
I can explain it to you, but I can't understand it for you.
“No matter how subtle the wizard, a knife between the shoulder blades will seriously cramp his style.”
The reality is that there are numerous figures with "can use X and Y" who cannot use X and Y at the same time: they have both available but must choose which one to use. And that's because while "and" allows all the options to be available the rules prohibit activating both. Certainly there are "and" combinations where most or all of the options can be chosen ("can use Perplex and Outwit", for example) but there are many others where that is not the case ("can use Hypersonic Speed and Phasing/Teleport").
Thank you, this is the most intelligent retort I've received thus far. Everyone else just goes "nuh uh! I don't want that to be true, so it isn't" you have actually provided vague and broad examples to support your argument. However, you contradicted yourself. Guys and girls you CAN'T pick and choose which rule you like. If the word AND permits perplex and outwit simultaneously, then the word AND also allows phasing/hss. Together. That's like saying you don't like the first turn immunity rule, so your inly going to abide by half of it. Or perhaps you have a theme team! Youyour probability rolls but you sonny want to allow players to remove a battlefield condition or listen to the rest of the prerequisites. Give me a week, I am requesting an OFFICIAL ruling and will post it soon. Until then...play how you want and break as many rules as you want.
Thank you, this is the most intelligent retort I've received thus far. Everyone else just goes "nuh uh! I don't want that to be true, so it isn't" you have actually provided vague and broad examples to support your argument. However, you contradicted yourself. Guys and girls you CAN'T pick and choose which rule you like. If the word AND permits perplex and outwit simultaneously, then the word AND also allows phasing/hss. Together. That's like saying you don't like the first turn immunity rule, so your inly going to abide by half of it. Or perhaps you have a theme team! Youyour probability rolls but you sonny want to allow players to remove a battlefield condition or listen to the rest of the prerequisites. Give me a week, I am requesting an OFFICIAL ruling and will post it soon. Until then...play how you want and break as many rules as you want.
There was really no need to raise this thread which had gone dormant for three weeks in order to provide incorrectness in a very rude manner where the correct answer had already been given.
IceHot was and is 100% correct. I'm not sure what you think was confirmed, but I'm here to provide the conformation that IceHot is correct.
If you are who you claim, then I do respect your ruling. Having said that, the typed word can be misinterpreted to be rude. It is challenging to figure out the subtext behind written words. Question:"character why are you claiming the word "AND" holds the same meaning as the word "OR" when official designers and erroradas were made producing a significant distinction between the two. Thank you.
Just gonna ask one question: "character must be within range AND line of sight etc etc" so do you guys believe that they mean OR EITHER OR, CHOOSE ONE, or perhaps and refers to AND IN ADDITION TO. I think its silly, this forum has the same credentials as wikipedia. Someone ask a question, and a random player answers. People believe since it was blogged about on hcrealms....it is legit. AND- IN ADDITION TO. OR-EITHER OR. it has already been confirmed, now continue playing the game wrong kiddies.
Quote : Originally Posted by InfinityWatchReturns
When a special states: you may AND you may. Guess what? As long as you do not break one of the three golden rules of heroclix, then you absolutely MAY perform that special. The entire point of a special is to give a player 'special' privlages over set rules other players must follow.
Here's a rules quote for you from the Comprehensive Tournament Rules document:
Quote
1.1.1 Rules Questions: All rules questions that come up during a HeroClix tournament are to be directed to the Head Judge of the event, who is the final authority on rules disputes for that event. Rules questions that come up outside of a tournament should be directed to the Rules Arbitrator. The rules arbitrator can be found online with the screen name TechG0D. Posts on message boards by TechG0D or an appointed Rules Deputy (Harpua, normalview, Quebbster, and vlad3theimpaler) are also legitimate means of rules communication. When two on-line posts conflict, the one with the later timestamp is deemed accurate. If an on-line post conflicts with any of the documents listed above, the document is deemed accurate. The rules team can also be contacted at [email protected].
I can confirm that your opinions are incorrect.
There is nothing about the phrasing of "X and Y" in a special power that will automatically cause those powers to be usable together.
Have a look at this dial:
Quote
ffha002 U Hogun
Team: No Affiliation
Range: 0
Points: 100
Keywords: Asgardian, Warrior, Warriors Three
9
10
17
3
9
10
17
2
8
10
16
2
8
9
15
1
7
9
15
2
7
9
16
2
6
11
17
3
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
(Attack) Watch Each Other's Back: When turning the dial, if there is another friendly figure with the Warrior's Three keyword within 3 squares and this click is revealed due to damage taken from an opponent's attack, stop turning the dial.
If one were to describe that first click, one would say "Hogun can use Charge and Close Combat Expert."
That does not mean that they can be used together.
Similarly, imagine that there was a special power that said "Necrodog can use Charge and Close Combat Expert." Nothing there does anything to make those compatible. Charge still grants a close combat action. Close Combat Expert still requires a power action.
Special powers only change standard powers through specifically calling out the changes.
Hey thanks for the link. However, I was fully aware of everything within its text. So im still not convinced that you have even read it. Im going to pursue my own avenue for an answer. It will be geared specifically towards one question, rather than a broad statement of combos cans and cants. Once again thank you for providing the link.