no way man, where s the LOGIC in that? harley is ON THE ground!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! does she have some sort of 20 foot staff with "HAHA!" on it that she waves in front of joker that blocks the LOF to joker?!? noooooooooooooo way, i ve played so many games where ive had characters running around the edges of buildings with my characters on the roof shooting at them and their grounded characters in the shooting back at me with my own characters against the base of the building...i would really like to see the ruling in print, posted up here, because my god, where s the logic here?! jeez, FAQ bound it has to go along with the stealth ruling! bejeezus, i cant say it any much more!

ITs LOF(LINE OF FIRE). There is no ruling that permits people on the ground to ignore everything on the ground.

THere is a ruling about people on elevated terrain to ignore everything except the square the Target is in.

FAQ info

Elevated Ranged Combat Attacks: An attacker on elevated terrain can target a grounded figure as long as the only blocking terrain the line of fire crosses is part of the square the attacker occupies. Line of sight from an elevated attacker is not blocked or hindered by other grounded figures or grounded hindering terrain unless the terrain occupies the same square as the target. A grounded figure can make a ranged combat attack against an elevated figure if the only blocking terrain the line of fire crosses is in the square the target occupies. Otherwise adjacent figures at different elevations cannot make close combat attacks against each other, but may target each other with ranged combat attacks.
1. Ground to Rooftop combat is only possible if the figure on the rooftop is at the edge of the roof. Otherwise, the intervening squares will block line of fire.
2. "Line of fire from an elevated attacker is not blocked or hindered by other grounded figures or grounded hindering terrain, unless the terrain occupies the same square as the target" This does not mean that line of fire from a grounded attacker is not blocked... etc. to an elevated target. The rules favor the elevated attacker. [FAQ]

This is one of the most basic rules in heroclix, yet it comes up all the time.
The person on the roof has an advantage, he can shoot over people. The people on the ground can not shoot over them. The person cactuar called an idiot was in fact correct, he used logic and the rules to guide him to the correct outcome. (Now cactuar could say it is illogical in a real world setting, but we can only apply logic to the rules in order to get a correct heroclix answer).

okok, i stand correctedd, and i ll accept it. i ll have to play our games from now on like this, thanks.

Do you play with Nightmare on your team alot?

Who plays with Nightmare a lot?

I think the problem is that a lot of people think Heroclix is a wargame or some kind of simulation of combat. It's not: it's a boardgame and it has it's own logic that's not always going to be applicable to the "real" world.

I see how the wording of the rules dictates this outcome, I just think it is completely ridiculous. Of course in the game itself Batman was simply replaced to the side as to be on a direct diagonal with the target and the game continued with him attacking.
I just wish common sense won out more often than: "hmm it says the indoor adventure kit is 'special' terrain, and it doesn't SPECIFICALLY say in the original rules that 'special' terrain from this kit is hindering so Wolverine isn't stealthed. BLAM... take 6 damage."
and yes, that was a fake example.

ok i really thought this thing over, i didnt see a flat out ruling where it said a fig 5 squares away blocks LOF from batman?

"A grounded figure can make a ranged combat attack against an elevated figure if the only blocking terrain the line of fire crosses is in the square the target occupies."

where does it say a fig 5 squares away blocks LOF? i suppose if someone was standing in front of him or so, then i d understand that, but with at least 2 space's worth of a buffer zone around batman (meaning he s adjacent to nobody) he should be able to fire back...i think i need some convincing to do...

First question.

Do figs block line fire?

Thats where it says it. There is no ruling that allows you to ignore figs that are in your way.

Elevetated now has a rule that ignores figs and terrain.

manchine, i understand your gist, but i m aiming UPWARDS, and if i remember reading somewhere, you could actually fire towards an elevated person. dang, WHERE was that...i just read the FAQ over on wizkids, it s kinda the same thing you're saying...i m just really baffled nobody ever really said a THING about it, both at my venue and home games...ill keep researching but it might be moot, considering you ARE a judge...:D

"But in the real world..."

yawn....

psylockelover, did i SAY in the real world? i have kept talking about heroclix-wise.

Its been said lancelot. Wizkids want it that way. Person on top of a elevated terrain has an advantage over someone that does not.