If there is a scenario I hope it does not mess up the game! And as far as striker in shallow water idea well I seen that army get smoked by the chariot! Now I spoke with 42up and got some ideas and finally beat that thing today badly. The chariot is very versitile and should not be taken lightly! Swarming I do not believe has any chance against a passenger with sweep! BUt the stirker water was played by someone who was playing it for the first time!

Notes on the wyvern: (and please excuse me if I am merely stating the obvious)

1) He is good against swarms. (Duh)

2) Barrel has a neat little tactic of capturing with the wyvern, so they must base you and take venom damage if they want their figure back. Obviously, this will work better in some games than others, and against a chariot/stomper tandem, it's quite useless.

As for replacing the wyvern ... :confused:

Well, there was the aforementioned two horned hatchetkrugg version. Obviously this has the drawback of not allowing the second ranged attack.

Next, we could use a ** soaring gunner for 44 points, with the drawback of losing 1 point of attack right off the bat. (ouch)
This may or may not work, depending on how well your opponent kept his 'softer' figures protected.

Or, there is the possibility of downgrading the horned hatchetkrugg, either switching it to the ** version, or using some sort of KI mountie, and adding in a ** horned impaler. I'm not sure of the points cost of this unit, however, so I really can't say how much you would need to cut.

I know the *** version is 49 points, which couldn't easily be made to fit here.

Also, yet again, we lose points on the attack. It might work and it might not, but I just don't like it!

Then there is the option of downgrading striker to Techun, and using the *** soaring and a *** horned impaler. You lose your charger, but get 3 ranged threats in the exchange.

Problem is, you now have 10 points left. I would suggest 2 imps, or podo and a ** imp, but you would really have to use them carefully and in 'emergency only' situations so you wouldn't give up the easy points.

I dunno. It's 2 am and my brain isn't quite up to par (as if it ever was :D ).

Anybody else got some idears?

Hitman

DEEP water in my terrain pool. I use 2 blocking and 2 deep water. If you have to play against chargers as much as I do then you use deep water. Shallow water is going to slow down normal elf swarm but it is not goin got do #### against charge. Since the whole thing is you do no thave ot stop until your whole base enters hindering ( most terrain a charge can make it through) but deep water forces them to go around. I do believe the stomper can be captured on some of its end clicks.

barrel:What do you mean about the stomper? Did someone mention it?

Hitman: downgrading to techun makes all those good match ups versus amotep gunners, now into bad ones(not that any match up is good versus gunners really, but....) You do get more points but at too great of a cost.

I think you have to get in 2 ranged figs for GA to compete in 200 pts. Otherwise the best you can hope for is the pick off an imp strategy, which fails if your opponent doesn't play easy kill stuff.

so right now Im testing:
striker
scarabet
hvy lancer*

the scarabet doesn't move as fast as I like, but since nothing else fits well something has to give. It also combines with the striker to be able to take out a 7 click figure in one turn. allowing you to shoot for things like gunners and shamen, and suroks and such.

Well, as was flamed-out on another thread <now deleted>, we have had several reservations about the scorpem gunners vs the soarings, and just as many militant views in favor of the scorpems.

Try it and PLMK what you come up with. I agree that somethings got to give, and dropping your primary ranged attacker's range value from 14 to 12 isn't necessarily the best option, even if it is on a monster like techun that gunners would need a 9 to hit. You just can't afford to gamble.

I wish I could play a few and help out in this area, but I'm busy with super-duper secret stuff for WK right now, and my hands are literally full.

As for the stomper, I believe Barrel mentioned it in reference to the chariot/stomper army that Chunga reported on. You would have to damage the stomper pretty good before the wyvern <or anybody else> could capture it.

Let me know how it goes.

Hitman

further reasoning on the bounder:

to get the second ranged speedy ranged guy, you have to go to at least 45 pts for the soaring. But then the krugg doesnt fit and neither does the nightmare reaper. The next option is aybador, but he doesn't fit well leaving 39 pts for the charger. A regular scorpem leaves 41 points whcih would be a nightmare reaper**, which could work, but since Im using 2 fragile guys with the striker, I might as well try to boost my ranged attack value as much as I can too further lesson the "oops, I missed, I guess I lose now" factor.

The soaring's 10" range just doesn't threaten a cautious opponent enough to get the kind of reaction that you can take advantage of.

Agreed, Bshugg.

When the soaring really shines is in situations that you posess a points advantage already, and/or the striker is commanding alot of attention. He should always be considered the secondary threat, 'the adder that strikes the heel', so to speak.

Definitely NOT the guy you want to send in to try to open up the game, or create the points advantage.

On the other hand, he lives forever and retains flight until his next to last click. He still has flight after a regular *** scorpem would be dead. (Not sure about Scarabet, and too lazy to go look.)

The ability to 'hop over' terrain to get itself into or out of trouble can't be dismissed lightly.

The scorpem can start from 15" away, bound to 10" away, and shoot. This is his advantage; first strike.

The soaring can land nearby behind a wall, rest, then pop over that wall to threaten. He may fire, he may not, but your opponent will have to react.

One is 10" away AFTER he fires, and the other is 10" away before and after he fires.

One can take 3 clicks and still fly back over the terrain to safety; the other one loses bound if he takes 3 clicks and has some pretty shabby movement and is from then on a liability and a weakness.

With each unit, you must plan your attacks carefully. You can't just drop either of them in front of the main enemy formation and expect to walk away unscathed. If I may quote myself:

"...striking deep in the rear areas at critical or vulnerable spots."

It's all according to the army you face, I guess. Against a melee/FM force, I would go scorpem, hands down. Against a ranged group, I would take the soaring, flying around behind them and forcing them to cover all arcs, thus diminishing their ability to do ranged formations and concentrated firepower.

For example, 3 troll artillerists aren't quite so intimidating if you force them to spread and cover a 180 deg arc or better. This would allow a more favorable matchup with your main threat and your charger(s).

Is it worth the trade-off, however, to have a piece that threatens alot, but doesn't get off many shots? NO, I really don't think so. But I do feel it's a reasonable attempt at making the best of a tight budget. (Haven't we all been there before?)

Perhaps a group like this would work:

Striker
*** Fell Reaper
*** Soaring Gunner

You lose your charger, which hurts, but you gain a quality unit back in its place that can dish out some punishment, and as we all know, is excellent at hitting the softer spots.

Just my thoughts.

Hitman

PS, on a side note, the stomper has to be on his absolute last click before he loses battle fury, at which point he has a pitiful 4" movement. Capturing this guy and dragging him home is not a very viable option. If you get him down that far, I would just whack him for the points. Carry On, Lads.

I'm going to try this on Saturday. A friend of mine is bringing the KI Charge/Jarl Frostriven combo over, so I can test against that.

Chunga

Has anyone else tried GA tactics with Uhlrick? I have a Necro Army I posted in December that used GA tactics, I just resurrected the thread for new ideas in Battle Formations.

I didn't completely commit to GA, guess that makes the army a mutt, but used many of the basic principles. The army in the thread is a three hundred pointer, but Uhlrick's points are so close to the Striker, it might work in place.

Also, has anyone tried the Nightmare Banshee? the ** is pretty effective, and IMO SW is the GA's answer to F/Lfor gunner armies.

Yeah, we played with Uhlrik in the 300 points at one time, but never in the 200 point versions.

Since Rick could use blocking terrain better to get into strike range, we swapped the striker out for a destroyer, who could MB behind the walls. Tossed in the obligatory charger and we had 48 points left, so in went the baptist preacher.

Rick
Sol. Destroyer
*** Horned Hatchetkrugg
* Corrupted Priest

My wife and I played one game with this configuration, against some wannabe's 'this army could kick your GA's butt' army, and needless to say, rick and the destroyer had a field day.

She advanced up behind the blocking and started bombing, keeping the Hkrugg nearby and the priest a bit downfield, then sped rick away and out of my firing arcs. I repositioned and pushed to take a shot, missed. Rick slammed into them on the next turn and started cleaning up. She then sent in the krugg so he could play too, and next thing you know, I was a dead duck.

In summary, yep, Rick works pretty good. Never tried rick + striker + 70 points of other stuff, however. Someone over on BF posted a few armies like that, perhaps you could do a search and dig them up.

Carry On, Lads.
Hitman