bshugg, I certainly wish you luck and would also be curious to see what you come up with, but I have a certain amount of skeptisicm about how good the idea is.
I think its extremly hard to come up with a really truly accurate point system; most games never gets one thats truly perfect. That's not to say it cannot be improved; just that its a challenge!
Personally, I wouldn't really want to have to consult a list of altered point values every time I played a game. Its not something I would ever remember, that's for sure! I would hate it if WK actually did this.
On the flip side, I am actually ok with modifying the abilities of figures. Somehow for me its just easier to remember an ability change; probably because its more meaningful than a number. That's the approach our group has toyed with, though we've never really agreed on it.
Some of our modifiers include:
Wood Golems - Treats hindering terrain as clear for movement purpouses.
Tanglewood Spirits - Treats hindering terrain as clear for movement purpouses. Opposing models in base contact deduct 1 from rolls to break away.
Cave Archers - May shoot before moving when using Bound, or can shoot after moving as normal.

spend all the tiem you want learning the nuances of tanglewood spirits, they'll still suck.

All orc nons (even Ironclads) except volunteers should cost 2-3 points less. Clurch Pipers should move 12"

WizKids could set up a database which they update every week providing all of the new point values for the figures, like weekly power ratings. But seriously, it would be too much of a hassle to consult additional documents for the point value of a figure. Plus WizKids would have to admit that their formula is defective.

I dont really think it would be that difficult. Warhamster doesnt print figure costs on the bases yet the players manage to figure out how much they cost and build armies with them. You can even modify the figs (and the cost) of each individual fig making it even more complex.

Us MK players are just used to the point costs of the figs being lazily displayed for our convenience. It wouldn't take barely anymore work to consult a listing.

hope it would be legal....the creator of mageknight created this game to surpass war hammer's complexity.....by avoiding and minimizing reading of stats,,,, iread in the article that he has problem in reading.....your idea is great ....though:eek:
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Anime Weird
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RavenFoxxx cam

Im just wondering if anyone has a list of all the figures in Word or other text format. My internet at home is a bit slow so it would save me a bunch of time making the list.

you can Email it to me at [email protected]

I don't think Magus having 2 arrows and magic blast is pointless. I think someone said this earlier, but you could magic enhance the double arrows and make Magus do 2 shots of mass damage.

The other great thing about it is that Magus has an attack of 12 and will more than likely HIT his targets with double arrows. I believe alot of other figures tend to have a problem with hitting targets.


BTW what are LE figures? Elite figures only won in tourneys? And are they still somewhat fair in their point costs sot hey dont off balance the game for the other people?

In that case, why not just go ahead and change the stats as well, and consult reference sheets for that :D.

To me, the numbers on the base isn't something that can be discarded from MK; its half the reason to play MK instead of some other wargame!

Plus what criteria would you use to change the points? Would a whole new formula have to be developed, or would each figure have to be individually adjusted? Can you imagine all of the clamoring to change point values when someone discovers the latest broken figure.

Personally, I am not at all opposed to this being done. I don't think that it will ever impact serious tournaments, but altering point costs could make for some fun, silly scenarios. Now, I can't speak for bshugg, but I think it's safe to say that what he is planning would NOT involve a new point cost formula. He never claimed to be smarter than Wizkids, and I'm sure he recognizes that a new formula would likely be worse than the old one. What he wants to do is make some of the lesser figures in the game viable. For instance, nobody uses chimeric worms. Now pretend they were 15 points. You may see a chimeric worm or two pop up in armies now and then.

I'm sure that bshugg is willing to admit that new broken figures will almost assuredly appear. This is not a problem, as he considers the point costs of figures as changeable. If something becomes broken his point cost system would alter it. Now, nobody is trying to change the major, competative aspects of this game(I'm pretty sure we all recognize that Wizkids would not want this sort of thing sanctioned), however having a different point cost sheet could make for some very fun games in small local tournaments. It can get boring for players to see the same amazon drac army win a tournament every week, and having silly scenarios (perhaps involving new point costs), could help keep players interested.

:eek:

I say go for it - and on Klaw's thought - I believe that OR (and/or KI) should be the first faction(s) that are recosted.

Both of these factions are melee orientated, and they could easily be bounced off of each other for balance.

Bshugg, I'm interested! What do you need help with? Is it OK if I flame random people too? Let me know ASAP - I already started.

As for old skool, you don't even have to go there to understand the power of some of the "useless" figs. I realize the wood golem isn't going to crop up in armies across the nation tomorrow or anything, but think about other figs that are more marginal. They have uses, and having the mad MK skeelz to make your play better only enhances that.

Personally, I'm going to California for vacation tomorrow, and I'm taking a 300 pointer that looks like this:

Formation
Shyft Matriarch - 119
* Skele - 10
* Throttle Worms - 22
* Phooka x2 - 36

Loners
Astrus L4 - 63
** Stalking Skele - 23
*** Stalking Skele - 27


300 even. Now, I play against some people who play MK maybe once a month there, so I practice a *tad* more than them, but I'm out to try the matriarch for the first time ever, and I gotta tell you, she looks like she has her uses! Don't dis - 12" range, enhanced, baby! I can't wait! It's all about MK playin skeelz, baby! I'll let you all know how it goes.

;-)
Bri

Well If you want to help out (and have a fast connection) assemble a list of all the figures and their point costs in some txt format (word or excel would be great)

I live in a small town with slow internet. Everytime I refresh a page I have a 50/50 chance of it dying. It would take me hours to assemble a list when it would take someone with reliable internet a half hour at the longest cutting and pasting.

I may be wrong, but I think Drake's webpage already has all the figures sorted by expansion. If this is true you could get all the figures printed in 5 clicks (as opposed to the regular 50,000,000,000,000,000,000 it would take to do it on the realms or at the official page).

You're ABSOLUTELY right brian. The Matriarch does have her uses, and a great player like yourself could surely bring them out. Now, because I'm such a nice guy, I would even be willing to play a few games against your Matriarch army -- for money that is. I get to use the cheese I want, and you get to show me how "mad MK plain skeelz" will rule the day! Sound good? Call me to let me know when and where. Oh, does five billion dollars sound like a good betting number? If not, we can always raise it :D