I agree. I'm hoping I won't get a badly written Ion. So far, I haven't been let down by Coutdown like you have.

Also, I'm going to be a Kyle-geek for a minute. It has always bugged me the way John Byrne came in and broke things off with Donna Troy because he wanted her all to himself for Wonder Woman. (And his run on WW was crap anyway.) So the fact that Kyle and Donna's relationship will be getting some kind of attention is a big lure for me. I'm hoping to get some long-awaited resolution to that story.

its not silly. i made a point to say "there is no way, WAY supes would let him roam free IF he could find him so easily."

cap joining forces with punisher is different than supes joining forces with a punisher type for the simple reason that cap has killed people. he knows this. they know this. on top of that they were on the losing side of a civil war. he couldn't afford to say no to castle.

the superman situation is completely different. supes is on monitor duty. he checking crap out, trying to find evil to stop and LO AND BEHOLD!!!! there's a wanted murderer...hmm, i think instead of swooping down and arresting him i'll send my best pal jimmy over for an interview with teh psychotic ex-robin. yeah, totally in character there supes.

superman is the heroic ideal. he is held to a higher standard than any other hero and he rightfully should be. that's why scenes like the one from countdown should never be written. they point out the blatant hypocrisy of the character. it's bad writing and its writing from people who don't understand how to write Superman. Cap is only human...Superman is a god.

right there with you. i loved kyle and donna. this is about the only reason, for me anyway, to be excited about countdown. the seduction of mary marvel. :devious:

Oh come on, you've never liked a title that was hated by all but that you thought was fun. Read the rest of my post, I know it's dumb, it's still fun stuff that I look forward too. I love Frank Miller's old work and Jim Lee draws fantastically. Plus Batman is crazy, you should love it, that is until Frank Miller decides to write for Captain America. Just let me like my dumb comic in peace.

I forgot about Clark sending Jimmy to interview him. That was a pretty bonehead move.

But these kinds of problems are plentiful in any comic universe (especially one with a Superman). I remember the 9/11 issue of Spider-man. Apparently 9/11 happened in the Marvel Universe. The FF and the Avengers were down the block but they didn't stop the 2nd plane??? I let that kind of stuff go because it's expected in comics.

It's like how Buffy let Spike run around Sunnydale. How many chances did she have to stake him even before he got his chip implant? And afterwards, it took a pretty big suspension of disbelief to accept the idea she'd let him just run around mostly unsupervised.

I definitely see your point. But it's the sort of thing I've come to expect from super hero comics. Maybe it should bother me, but it just doesn't. At least not yet.

Now what does bother me is the season finale of Heroes. Why the heck did Nathan need to fly Peter to safety. I can think of a few other ways to keep NY safe. If Peter couldn't fly himself away, couldn't they have at least put in a line to say he couldn't control his other powers? And how did Hiro suddenly get the drop on Syler when nobody else could all season long? Why did Syler only defend himself after Hiro stabbed him? If he could shoot him off to fuedal Japan, why not do that while he's running at you with a sword?

I don't know why that stuff bothers me and the Superman/Red Hood stuff doesn't. Oh well.

I agree, that Karate Kid stuff pissed me off, I've seen it before with better art and also done better as well. In Justice League Batman kicks Karate Kid's butt and makes a mockery of Superman's rating system which was awesome, in here, Batman struggles with him, that doesn't make sense.

Also agreed, when I saw that ad I was intrigued, sexy women in compromising positions is always good. I was looking forward to Countdown for this and also because Darkseid, Joker, and Red Hood are involved, and also because it's main writer is Paul Dini who in the past has been a fantastic writer. So far, I haven't been to impressed, hopefully Jimmy will die next issue and some other interesting things happen. I'm still hopeful, 52 started out slow as well so here's hoping.

see, i was thinking about this more on the way to the comic store and it really started to get to me. like, in my mind, superman would never give a killer a pass. he's too pure. but then you have the problem of batman. he's a guy who's sworn to fight crime and punish the guilty and yet, AND YET...he allows a guy like the red hood to roam free? that's just stupid. obviously driven by plot instead of character. the more i think of it, the more i realize that NO, red hood should not get a pass from batman and if supes can find him that easily he should be telling bruce about it. that i can believe. allowing bats first dibs, that seems plausible. but to let him run around and pretend to be a hero? no way.

so why does he let him do it? guilt? no, i don't think that's it. guilt would motivate him to put his ### in jail or get him psychiatric help. is it because he knows who batman really is? this actually seems like the most plausible reason and something i think they should address instead of just playing the "well, red hood was trained by batman so if he wants to stay hidden he will" card which is total BS. batman is the greatest detective in the world. if he wants to find someone, IF, he will find them. this only leaves me with the conclusion that batman DOES NOT WANT to catch the red hood. therefore, batman is a douchebag on the level of tony stark douchebaggery...yeah, you read that right.

think about this: the green goblins (harry and norman) knew who peter parked was for years yet that didn't stop parker from trying to put them in jail every chance he got, regardless of the consequences. and any long time spidey reader will know that the goblins used their knowledge of his true identity to hurt him every chance they got.

(EDIT: actually, it's fairly obvious why bats doesn't catch red hood...cus the editors don't want him to be caught. sales driven. ARGH!)

i don't know. maybe this is why i like civil war and not IC. character motivated vs plot driven storytelling. yeah, you all scream about how out-of-character these characters were acting. what most of you fail to realize is that stark has always been a pragmatist and cap has always been an idealist. civil war isn't the first time these guys have come to blow over a disagreement. stark has always been a holier than thou control freak...if you don't believe, dig through your back issues. armor wars. operation galactic storm. extremis. mr. fantastic you say? what was the name of that storyline where he forces the FF to take over Latveria for "the good of the world"? authoritative action? yeah. that only happened a couple years ago.

the BEST part of IC was how it started. batman betraying the league by secretly building brother eye. wonder woman committing cold blooded murder. superman's failure to act on either of these events thereby showing his true weakness. that was good character driven stuff. then, after a single issue...DC CROSSOVER MODE takes over and we have been stuck in it ever since (with the exception of most of 52 which i don't even really consider a DC title, i'm talking about the year between IC and countdown and beyond in the monthly books). that's why i hate DC right now. that doesn't mean i've always hated it, it just means i hate it now.

nothing about countdown is character driven. nothing. so far. i hope they prove me wrong.

anyway, i didn't expect to vent so much. hopefully it keeps me from going nuclear on the cast tonight.

-TBZ

oh, and i don't watch heroes so i can't answer any of you questions. heh.

Billy. Dude. Get the DVDs or torrent the show or something. ASAP.

Spoiler space for Heroes Finale... In gray text....






I can answer them though. Peter can't control the exploding man powers and has never used more than one power at a time in the past so why the hell would he be able to fly himself away now that he's melting down!?

Sylar sees the future and probably knows that if he flees Hiro will actually kill him, like in the comic, but if he just stands there it will hurt and be painful but he'll live to crawl away and fight another day.

Even if Nathan 'survives', until we see him and Candice or him and Sylar in the same place we won't know whether or not it's really him. Which is why they had Nathan finally pull the trigger on his crisis of conscience and come to the rescue.

As for sending Hiro back in time... Sylar didn't. He TK'ed him away at high speed and Hiro panicked. A friend of mind said he'll probably find out his father's power is immortality, based on the "I've been waiting a long time for a Nakamura to ascend" line. I imagine either way he'll spend a long time being trained by his childhood hero and come back a blend of Future Hiro's bad assness and Present Hiro's enthusiasm and heart. Probably just in time to save the day.

-Mike

Yeah, Billy. You need to check out Heroes. Awesome show. Way better than Civil War. :p

I like your answers to my questions, RS. (Rep!) But the show really should have added a line of dialogue here and there so viewers didn't have so many unanswered questions about why things went down the way they did.

Back to the Superman/Red Hood thing:

Why doesn't Superman grab the Joker every time he busts out of Arkham? Think how many lives could be saved if someone at Arkham alerted Superman every time the Joker was missing. He could pick him up in 10 minutes and get back to work at the Daily Planet.

Yeah, Red Hood is getting a pass for plot reasons. This is business as usual for superhero comics.

that's my point. that's why joker isn't a superman villain. these types of hypotheticals don't bother me. i know why supes doesn't catch joker. it's when they actually put superman in the same issue as red hood that i get annoyed. superman is looking right at him in countdown 50?! why doesn't he do something? that's lame.

Now you're dead to me....I guess we'll have to be zombie buddies. Nah Billy I understand your frustration, beleive me, I've thought about it too, this is one of the reasons why I used to loathe Superman, he's too powerful. With the kind of power he has he should be like Flash in Kingdom Come. Always moving, always catching bad guys. Red Hood would be in jail, the Joker, whoever fill in the blank. The problem is, this would make for a crappy comic that you wouldn't read. If all the villians were almost instantly caught what would be the fun. The fact is Superman should be in like every DC comic. Every time a team or a hero faces a crisis, especially one on a global scale, Superman should be there. But if you're reading a Shadowpact comic, you shouldn't have to see Superman in it. That's why writers let heroes deal with their own problems in their own respective comics. If the Red Hood enters a Superman comic, then yes I agree he should be put away and yes in Countdown this kind of occured and it did bug me. I agree it is crappy writing, but all they would tell you is that this is a comic, don't take it so literally. I don't necessarily agree with this, just stating it. Anyway sorry to rant. You got good opinions Billy, don't let this crap bother you so much. Just hope Countdown gets better and I'll be right there with you. Anyway keep up the good work and go easy on me in the podcast. Do you think you guys will record tonight and have it out by tommorow? I hope so, don't go all Hollywood on me.

Great show...the true travesty is that the fantastic Eternals series was overshadowed by the mess called Civil War. I picked up the Bachalo/Carey stuff when last home it truly has some fantastic scenes and then got the space saga stuff as well on a recommendation from the store wasn't happy with it at all...not a fan of Tan's art...enjoyed the cast as always

chao

Check carefully:

(a) Red Hood does NOT kill the 'high-tech ninja'.

He is shown zip tying one of their hands before tossing him into the pile [the 'plastic hand cuffs'].

Me might at least know that Supes is watching and thus not giving him a reason to drop down there.

And, ultimately you are saying "If Superman is so powerful, why doesn't he just go and lock up every super-villain in the world?"

Which is of course the problem with MOST characters who have a power level higher as high as Superman.

But to make what is basically an INHERENT problem to Superman and use it as an argument of wh you don't like this book in particular. Just because it happens to HILIGHT one of the 'problems' with Superman being so powerful and NOT doing and locking up every homicidal maniac on the planet.

Also, maybe he's just a bit more 'lenient' considering that Wonder Woman [And Superman HIMSELF ... although with the return of the Kryptonian Supervillains ... perhaps his execution was retconned out ...] have killed in the past. Red Hood does seem to be working for the good guys, although he's gone back and forth. Heck, considering that count down started with Duela Dent going bad [last time I checked, she was in the Titans] ... perhaps Red Hood has turned over a new leaf? Or Superman is watching him to catch him in the act, and Red Hood just hasn't killed anyone yet [even Superman knows that you can't just scoop up a villain and throw them in jail whenever you see them on the street ...]

It would have to be narrated by the Monitors to be as bad as WW3. And have flashes to random things without context. Here, they dedicate at least a few pages to anything they 'cut' to ... which is one of your problems with it ;)