its solid if you can guarantee the mystical imo

I took this to the elite series:

3 A Proud Zinco Product
3 Air-Walker™ ~ Gabriel Lan
1 Barbara Gordon <> Oracle, Hacker Extraordinaire
2 Bat Got Your Tongue?
1 Batman, Cape and Cowl
4 Black Cat™ ~ Nine Lives
4 Creation of a Herald
1 Crime Doctor, Bradford Thorne
2 Mind Gem ~ Unique ? Infinity Gem
4 Empire State University
4 Enemy of My Enemy
2 Galactus™ ~ Devourer of Worlds
2 Galactus™ ~ The Maker
2 Gift Wrapped
4 Lockjaw™ ~ Inhuman's Best Friend
1 New Baxter Building
1 Only Human,
1 Red Shift™ ~ Rift Walker
3 San™ ~ The Alienated One
1 Slaughter Swamp
1 Soul World
1 Spider-Man™ ~ Stark's Protégé
3 Spider-Man™ ~ The Sensational Spider-Man
1 Terrax™ ~ Harbinger of Ruin
1 The Sentry™ ~ Golden Guardian of Good
1 United Planets HQ ~ Team-Up
4 Waking the Ancestors
1 Worldeater apparatus
1 Human Torch ~ Invisible Man
1 mxy

only losses came from random ### deck implosions.

So we finally have another tutor!

Call in a Favor replaces SttG. Which means the only recursion we may need is location based.

This opens up about 4 card slots...

Good times.

CC

we also have a team symbol for the spider-friends, thanks to human torch. very nice.

what is SF looking like for silver (upcoming City champ)?
*MEX/MCG are legal*

clones got a 2-drop ...
crisis is still around too.
bodyslide/curse of darkness help clones too.

with many decks coming out of legends looking to end games on or around 4, does stall (see above) have a place in the meta?

I'm not sure what SF will look like for silver, but I'm afraid that it won't be very prominant in the meta due to the lack of speed. There should be stronger stalling options starting at 3 other than Mattie Franklin. Alot of the breakthrough is caused between turns 3-5. Also, there are not many options at 5; Deathlok can prevent some breakthrough but can't really prevent the attack from going off.

We could try using some of the new cards from the new Galactus set. Pathetic Attempt is a stronger version of Trial by Jury although it has a higher threshold. Only Human from MVL has some potential, but do most card effects go off before the combat phase?

It's unfortunate that SF doesn't have some of the plot twist control that GK has. Spidey is a scientist after all, maybe not as the same level as Batman but he's still up there. Maybe if UDE makes another SF set it can center around a similar form of plot twist control. Just some wishful thinking.

We need ways to get through all the loads of damage pumps. Def pumps alone won't cut it. But I'm not sure what options we have right now.

I've yet to find a strong SA build for Spider Friends that doesn't include stalling to Sentry/Galactus.

Anyone toyed around with adding in some Wolverine-based PTs (ala Berserker Rage and Adamantium Claws) and going ape with the 6-drop?

I'm working on a Spider-man/Wolverine deck, but it focuses on the the 5 drop Wolverine, Bub.

So are we really just short on options for the time being?

BTW, there's a SF deck in the Deck Garage from the past pro circuit being discussed. Check it out if you haven't already.

continued from here.

carry on.

He can also try to go with clones. It can be made very cheaply:

4 Aunt May
4 Black Cat
4 Puppet Master (MOR)
4 Spiderman, Webhead
1 Sensational Spiderman
3 Spiderman, Parasitic Host/Bagman -> Sensational replacements
2 Spiderman, Alien Symbiote
2 Captain America, Loyal Patriot
4 Scarlet Spider, Ben Reilly
1 Spiderman, Sensational Spiderman
1 Spiderman, Outlaw
3 Amazing Spiderman
1 Spiderman, Stark's Protege
1 The Sentry
1 Cosmic Spiderman

2 Empire State University
2 Ego Gem -> Empire State University replacements

2 Indebted
2 Costume Change -> Indebted replacements
4 Entangle -> Giftwrapped replacements
4 Neighborhood Watch
4 Flying Kick
4 Reconstruction Program/Return of Donna Troy -> swamp replacements

If you don't have or can't get Cap, try getting Daredevil, Matt Murdock. As a last resort, you can try Moon Knight, Knight of Khonshu. Basically all you really want is to have a good defensive Marvel Knights character on turn five as an option to ensure loyalty for Spectacular Spiderman. If you do not have access to common cards from mmk, just go with four Alien Symbiote spidermans and replace Spectacular Spiderman with Daredevil, new kingpin. If you can't get more Amazing Spiderman, just go with some Dr. Stranges from MVL. All the rest are commons. The trick is just to survive until your 8-drops win the game for you. Exhaust your way to turn 8 and win.

first of all, thank you ukyo_rulz for the decklist. i would try it, but im missing 3 webhead, 2 neighborhood watch, 1 puppet master, 2 gift wrapped fillers (i have 1 entangle and 1 chilly reception) and either 5 drop cap or 5 drop daredevil. did i mention i pulled really crappy from my mvl box? i will try to track these cards down though.

as for mono sf, you have some very good suggestions for me osm. i guess i can see dropping the drakes for more useful stuff, but as far as 1 drops go i think he's bested by only aunt may as he is very functional to be certain. in the 2 drop area im seeing that 4 black cats (nine lives) are pretty much the starting point, and it would seem blade is pretty popular, though honestly im not 100% sure why, but i would prefer stay mono affiliated. plus i dont really have any sans anyway. im doubting the usefulness on any cardiacs really after playtesting him, and as good as mattie is, im not to clear on the appropriate amount, though i like the prospect of being able to use her for costume change bait if i keep 6-drop mattie, which is very likely. i wonder if it would be worth tracking down toxins, or perhaps the new 3-drop punisher is worth it? i have my 1 sensational as my 1st 4-drop no questions, and i guess, at least 2 hosts, though the only strength i see is the concealed option, but i suppose thats worth it. i also like substituting between hulk and bagman depending on the init. should i worry about a non-spiderman in my 4-drops, like sleepwalker? for 5-drops, i unfortunately dont have any white tigers, but i will talk to my friends to see if i can find them. im guessing venom is worth leaving in? i would most definately have a firestar, but alas i didnt pull one from my msm box. which human torch ar you reffering to and where can i get it? surprisingly, the people i play against find man-thing highly annoying. i find that an iceman gets gang banged once he hits the board and doesnt actually get much chance for his ability to go off. daredevil is the goods, has is mattie franklin<>spider-woman. i wonder how many scarlets are useful? i dont clone so much with this version, but the ability actually does synergize with my pay-atk-when-attacking abilities. after that i just run 2 7s (amazing and protege) and 2 8s (sentry and cosmic spidey) i recently took out an ezekiel, i dont think its worth it at that point.

location wise, im asking around about slaughter swamp and soul worlds. i have an avalon space station. i was wondering if it would be worth running 2 new baxter buildings and 2 mind (ego till i get them) gems to combo with black cat and fill in for the esu's i dont have.

i know i really need gift wrapped. what can i say, 2 boxes and i didnt pull one. i have 1 chilly reception, 1 entangle, and 1 flame trap. im assuming these and possibly another filler card will suffice until i happen across them? yeah, a box of origins and legends, yet now savage beats. i did get one big leagues from mtu though. is my one copy of against all odds (super dodge) worth it? i have reconstruction programs and return of donna troys if i need them. no mobilizes from mvl, but if i need filler, i do have vicarious living.

You can also go with something like this list until you can get Entangles or Gift Wrapped:

4 Black Cat
4 Dusk/Blade
4 Mattie Franklin, Reserve Webhead
2 Cardiac
4 Spiderman, Parasitic Host
1 Sensational Spiderman
1 Spiderman, Peter Parker
4 Michael Collins, Deathlok
4 Daredevil, New Kingpin
2 Amazing Spiderman
1 Spiderman, Stark's Protege
1 The Sentry

2 Empire State University
1 Avalon Space Station
2 Ego Gem

2 Indebted
2 Costume Change
3 Reconstruction Program/Return of Donna Troy
4 Spider Senses
1 Against All Odds
3 Acrobatic Dodge
4 Flying Kick
4 Down, but not Out

1-drops are bad because unless you draw them turn 1, you need to underdrop to play them (unless they're free). Also, drake is too aggressive for SF anyway. You need to focus on stalling.

Blade has good stats and a useful ability. Dusk is also good here, because she combos well with down but not out.

For a non-clone deck Daredevil is better than Mattie on six, unless you plan on playing 40+ characters, most of them reservists.

Nope. Mattie is better in mono SF.

The stall is what you really want. SF needs to stall. If you can keep yourself alive to turns 7-8, you should win. Host helps you stay alive.

Untested Idea: You may also choose to focus on bouncing attacks by playing 4x Blade, 4x Parasitic Host, and 4x sticky situation and as many resets as you have. It's a nasty, nasty combo.

Deathlok is similar, and an adequate replacement. White Tiger is better if you decide to play Dusk, though.

Play that. It's basically the same as Swamp.

Ego Gem is actually better than Mind Gem, IMO. Amazing Spidey requires a large hand to really get going.

here's what i got now, it recently beat the insanity by turn 6.

4x aunt may
4x black cat
2x blade
4x mattie franklin
2x cardiac
1x the sensational spider-man
3x parasitic host
2x the amazing bag-man
2x michael collins<>deathlok
2x venom
1x daredevil
1x mattie framklin<>spider-woman
1x man-thing
1x scarlet spider
1x the amazing spider-man
1x stark's protege
1x cosmic spider-man
1x the sentry

2x empire state university
1x avalon space station
2x ego gem

3x flying kick
2x poker night
4x spider senses
1x entangle
1x chilly reception
2x sticky situation (trying these with blade/host)
1x big leagues
1x against all odds
2x indebted
2x costume change
2x reconstruction program

here's my "sideboard" (stuff i'm still considering)
spider-man, peter parker
4th spider-man, parasitic host
4x acrobatic dodge
4th flying kick
2x poker night
2x return of donna troy
2x going my way?
1x flame trap
1x armageddon

by the way, osm: what is this torch your reffering to?

click

First, lets look at bagman. he allows you to, basically, get a puppet master effect whenever he becomes stunned. on his initiative: whats to prevent him from attacking spidey last, thus negating his effect? on your initiative: whats to prevent him from exhausting a smaller guy? The problem is you are never going to get the best effect off you can with him on 4, because you're either trading with a lower cost guy in order to exhaust a 4-drop with bagman's effect, or you're going to exhaust a smaller guy. He really only shines when your opponent has 2 characters, and even then, only on your initiative.

so I'd replace bagman with a parasitic host. to be honest, I like spider-hulk more than bagman. if for nothing else then the flavor is good.
sticky situation is awesome with host/blade. But, because host is expensive, I'd add mxy if you can get him, from crisis. if not, the phantom stranger from JSA in the same set does a similar thing. basically you can exhaust 2 guys during the build phase to bring him from your ko pile to your hand. this'd 'prolly be an off-initiative move.

one more thing on the host/blade. timing. its much better to tie down guys on your initiative, because the guy is theoretically tied down for 3 turns. one, the turn you tie them down. two, the turn they're just sitting there not ready from the previous turn, and three, its your initiative again.

I know man-thing looks really cool, but he just doesn't cut the butter.
He's cool if he's team-attacked, because you can reveal guys from your hand as many times as there are attackers, but if I were playing against manthing, I wouldn't bother to attack him if I could. or, I'd pump a guy's attack if I could. In such a case, I would stun at the start of recovery, but if you had a normal 6-drop, I'd be stunned during the combat phase. me having fewer characters on the board unstunned makes a difference when you go to attack back.

If you need another exhaust-like effect, Pleasant Distraction prevents guys from attacking :ermm:

if you can consistently keep both black cat and aunt may in play, then yes. keeping aunt may in play is harder than it looks. also, exhaust black cat over aunt may for ESU every single time (to all in general, not directed at anyone in particular).