You are currently viewing HCRealms.com, The Premier HeroClix Community, as a Guest. If you would like to participate in the community, please Register to join the discussion!
If you are having problems registering to an account, feel free to Contact Us.
Yeah, I can't blame anyone for being annoyed or frustrated by the MCU = 616 decision. It feels like it was picked to give the fans a shoutout, but I think it winds up feeling confusing and maybe makes the comics seem less valid, depending on who you ask.
There's certainly a concern within the comics industry that the movies haven't been as good for the comics as they should -chiefly in that people aren't spurred to go to comic stores as a result of watching.
In contrast to that, however, I've heard that whenever a character appears in a movie, that Heroclix figure suddenly becomes very popular!
Doctor Strange also has a robust thematic story, handled mostly in relation to his utilitarian choice in ENDGAME -briefly sacrifice countless lives to save the universe. Christine and others refer to him as “the guy who has to be holding the scalpel” -the guy who has to control everything, make the hard decisions, and kill to save. Doctor Strange considers himself broken permanently -signified by the broken watch Christine gave him- and everyone else thinks he’s the one who’s going to break the multiverse -after all, he's arrogant enough to think he can control it in every other dimension. That same broken watch also signifies his lost love with Christine, another thing he considers irreparable.
MCU Strange’s encounter with Evil Strange indicates what might’ve been MCU Strange’s tipping point: Christine asking Strange if he was happy at the beginning of the film. The film repeats this question throughout. It is also THE question drove Evil Strange mad, leading him to cause a dimensional incursion to get Christine back. MCU Strange would’ve pondered that what if… if not for Gargantos’ attack in NYC. That is to say, if not for the plot of the film, perhaps Strange would’ve become the multiversal destroyer the Illuminati feared.
Ah, Gargantos, the first of many beautiful monsters in this film. And one who has a pretty gnarly death! I think we all expected this dude to be Shuma Gorath (thank you, MARVEL VS. CAPCOM 2 for that education), but I believe Gargantos was picked because Shuma Gorath is Strange’s Cthulhu, and you don’t kill an elder god that easily.
That said, I do believe the early deaths in the film -Sorcerer Supreme Strange and Gargantos- hint how violent the rest of the film will be.
Hurling Busses: Super Strength. Gargantos deals +1 damage when making object attacks Flailing Tentacles: FREE: Make a Close Attack. Invisible Tracker: Capture. // Gargantos has Shape Change until the first time they take damage this game.
Fun bit of trivia - the name “Shuma Gorath” is legally owned by the holders of Robert E Howard’s works since it was one of his stories the name was taken from. So Marvel has the creature, but Howard has the creature’s name.
ASK ME ONCE I’LL ANSWER TWICE JUST WHAT I KNOW I’LL TELL BECAUSE I WANNA!
SOUND DEVICE AND LOTS OF ICE I'LL SPELL MY NAME OUT LOUD BECAUSE I WANNA!
Fun bit of trivia - the name “Shuma Gorath” is legally owned by the holders of Robert E Howard’s works since it was one of his stories the name was taken from. So Marvel has the creature, but Howard has the creature’s name.
Whoa, fantastic intel, friend! I wasn't aware of that!
Wonder if Raimi wanted to use Shuma-Gorath but had to settle for Gargantos for legal reasons. I know that Marvel just lost their publishing rights to Conan, as per this article: https://screenrant.com/marvel-confir...vage-avengers/
It's interesting, Marvel started publishing Conan like crazy once they got the rights back to the point that I was starting to think they were seeding the ground for an MCU Conan the Barbarian movie...
Although I love the titular character, I didn’t like DOCTOR STRANGE (2016). It had a clumsy, problematic script with a great-but-ill-fitting climax, and it got a ton wrong about Strange lore. I still hate Sling Rings. I hated that the Eye of Agamotto was the Time Stone instead of being, y’know, the literal Eye of Agamotto in an amulet. I thought Tilda Swinton shouldn’t have been cast as the Ancient One, and that doing so only accentuated Strange’s Orientalist origins. The performance was one step short of Yellowface.
In many ways, DOCTOR STRANGE 2 improves upon this clumsiness by making the Eye of Agamotto function like it did in the comic, by giving Doctor Strange spells that resemble their comic book forms (like INFINITY WAR and ENDGAME did), and by recentering Wong as one of most important figures in the story.
Wong’s strength lies in not being a mystical monk stereotype, but in being a blunt, down-to-earth, compassionate guy with a sense of humor. He is a mystical monk, but he’s a human being first, and his new leadership of Kamar-Taj feels like a strong reclamation of the lore by the people whose culture had been appropriated by it.
Just as America Chavez is a challenge to White hegemony, so is Wong’s leadership. Notice: Doctor Strange spends the whole movie flippantly disregarding Wong’s title -he is not giving Wong due respect. His bowing to Wong at the end of the film shows Strange recognizing Wong as friend and leader. That also ties into Strange learning that he doesn’t need all the power and control. He can be subordinate, and that’s ok.
It is customary to bow to the Sorcerer Supreme: Leadership & Probability Control. Energy Rope-Dart: Giant Reach: 3. During your turn, choose one: Exploit Weakness -OR- when Wong hits with an attack, deal hit opposing characters an Action Token. Wong has that until you choose again.
MCU Wong has been a surprise favorite for me. It's not that I didn't like comic Wong; I just never felt anything toward him. But since Dr. Strange 1, I've really loved his character! I really like his development into the Sorcerer Supreme, and the evolution of the friendship between him and Strange has been really fun to watch.
I’ll definitely add to the praise for both the character of Wong and your adaptation of this movie’s skill set. I particularly love the climbing/combat dart thing.
Wong was definitely one of the potential pitfalls of this series, being kinda the cliched Asian manservant to the hero, and making him a full on sorcerer in his own right was a great sidestep, especially since he got to play a role all his own in Shang-Chi.
ASK ME ONCE I’LL ANSWER TWICE JUST WHAT I KNOW I’LL TELL BECAUSE I WANNA!
SOUND DEVICE AND LOTS OF ICE I'LL SPELL MY NAME OUT LOUD BECAUSE I WANNA!
MCU Wong has been a surprise favorite for me. It's not that I didn't like comic Wong; I just never felt anything toward him. But since Dr. Strange 1, I've really loved his character! I really like his development into the Sorcerer Supreme, and the evolution of the friendship between him and Strange has been really fun to watch.
Quote : Originally Posted by Hein2208
Wong is great. Both the character and your dial.
Quote : Originally Posted by No-Name
I’ll definitely add to the praise for both the character of Wong and your adaptation of this movie’s skill set. I particularly love the climbing/combat dart thing.
Wong was definitely one of the potential pitfalls of this series, being kinda the cliched Asian manservant to the hero, and making him a full on sorcerer in his own right was a great sidestep, especially since he got to play a role all his own in Shang-Chi.
Many thanks, friends! This movie's Wong certainly gave me a lot to work with for building the dial. Honestly, I feel there are several other strong interpretations available, especially in terms of climbing the mountain with his rope-dart and in being the Sorcerer Supreme of Kamar-Taj.
Wong is low-key one of the best renovations in the MCU, transforming a racist archetype into his own, self-determining character. More than any other MCU side character, you get the sense that Wong has a rich personal life that doesn't resolve around his "main character," Doctor Strange, and that being Sorcerer Supreme means he might have a broader view of what's happening in the MCU at any given moment. To him, Doctor Strange might be a friend and colleague... but still a reckless and crazy one who's still struggling to get beyond his own self-interests.
Quote : Originally Posted by Kaden
I cannot way to see your take on Scarlet Witch.
My thanks, friend! We can speed that up, then! Hopefully it lives up to expectations!
Throughout the film, Strange is referred to as a scalpel, and we frequently see him cutting things -fewer as the film goes on- until he finally refuses to sacrifice America Chavez in the climax.
Meanwhile, we’re introduced to Wanda as she’s pruning a tree, cutting flowers en masse, and we see from her work that she’s been cutting things for a while. She is a character who cares nothing about the lives of others, save for what she wants.
I was nervous about this because HOUSE OF M and THE DARK PHOENIX SAGA always bothered me. Both were stories about a woman attaining godly power, being unable to handle it, nearly destroying everything as a result, and needing to be killed to stop them. It was always gross, and the fact that THE DARK PHOENIX SAGA ending with Jean’s death was an editorial mandate should’ve hinted that maybe it wasn’t the right call. I was worried that we’d see that play out here.
Instead, Wanda’s obsession is tied both to her real pain and the Darkhold, and her villainy feels like the consequences that WANDAVISION hadn’t given her. Her ending in this -recognizing her own villainy and destroying the Darkhold and herself lest they threaten the multiverse once more- feels thus like an act of penance and a recognition that she’s allowed her pain to make her the worst version of itself.
That said, Elizabeth Moss gives an insane performance, full of insane, unspoken emotional depth and complexity -that first Dreamwalking scene is INCREDIBLE. And as a horror villain? Get out of town. Raimi turns her into a coldhearted witch with tons of jump-scares, body-horror, and blood-covered mania to make her a legitimate, suspenseful threat every time she’s on screen.
An innocent woman:At the beginning of the game, you may generate a Wanda Maximoff Variant bystander anywhere on the map. That bystander is friendly to your opponents force this game. Dreamwalking: POWER: The Scarlet Witch may make an attack drawing range and line of fire from any other character on the board whose name or real name contains "Scarlet Witch" or "Wanda Maximoff." This is me being *reasonable*: Energy Explosion & Psychic/Penetrating Blast. If the target characters have hit Scarlet Witch since your last turn, damage dealt from this attack cannot be reduced. The Darkhold's Power: STOP. Invincible. This Isn't a Tomb; It's a Throne Room: Perplex, Outwit, and Probability Control.
#115b Wanda Maximoff Variant
Range: 5
Points: 0
7
9
15
2
Under a spell: Adjacent friendly characters can use Mastermind, but only to choose Wanda Maximoff Variant.
That dial feels fitting. I like that the attack special is more potent if you piss her off, and I like that the more mystical-seeming damage powers get bundled at the end, when she’s in the Wundagore cave.
The ”Dreamwalking” trait is perfect, even if it is very situational.
As for the movie, I’m not sure how I feel about Wanda’s turn to villainy.
It’s such a drastic turn from where we last saw her. At the end of WandaVision, she gave up her family to save a bunch of strangers from her own actions, because it was the right thing to do.
But now, she’s cool with mass murder, and with doing to other Wandas what was done to her, as long as she gets her prize. To me, that’s a big leap.
Of course, there’s an obvious answer: The Darkhold corrupted her. But relying too much on that reasoning is also unsatisfying, because it somewhat forces you to take the blame off of Wanda herself.
How difficult is it to resist Darkhold corruption? How strongly does it affect you?
Beyond her making the irresponsible choice to start reading the Darkhold, which could mostly be blamed on ignorance, can we actually blame Wanda for her actions?
We wouldn’t blame her, if an evil telepath was mind controlling her. We don’t blame 838-Wanda for the deaths of the Illuminati.
How different is this really?
So we either have an unrealistically big heel turn, or a movie with no one to really blame. Or some middle ground between them, I suppose.
The first words we hear in DOCTOR STRANGE 2 are in Spanish, and that’s a big deal for Latinx representation and for Marvel Studios continuing to diversify its cast. I also think that it nods toward the film’s subtext.
When I walked out of the theater, I heard teens complaining, “It doesn’t make sense for a Hispanic chick to be called ‘America,’” and like, dude, you’re saying a Latinx person can’t be American? America Chavez is a complex challenge to White hegemony because she constantly defies expectations and traditions. She’s a naturally and precociously talented character who comes from a lesbian family (is this a dimension exclusively of women like in the comics? We intentionally don’t know). She’s Hispanic, and American-themed -qualities against expectations of White audiences, fed decades of White, Male patriotic stars. She represents the changing face of the future, and everyone wants to exploit her.
Critically, Wanda -a White woman- wants to kill a Latina teen to prevent the world from moving on and instead recreate her defunct, White suburban fantasy that was built on a twisted lie in the first place. What’s more, Wanda isn’t interested in briefly using America Chavez’s powers and letting her be; Wanda wants to kill America for her powers so she can micromanage the multiverse, desperately holding onto power and her motherhood, even at the expense of countless other worlds.
Movie’s trying to say something, y’all.
Marvel apparently refused to cut the footage of America’s two moms for Saudi Arabia, which is great. LGBTQ+ communities around the world are under attack now more than ever, and even this little bit of normalization in media helps a little bit.
#112 America Chavez
Team: No Affiliation
Range: 0
Points: 50
Keywords: Kamar-Taj, Mystical, Teen
10
10
17
1
10
10
17
1
10
10
17
2
10
10
17
3
10
10
17
3
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
KO
I've been to 72 dimensions, 73 counting this one: During set-up, modify your initiative roll by +1. If you lose the roll, you choose the map and first player places their figures first. You don't want to get stuck in the paint dimension: Carry: 3. Can't Control It: Phasing/Teleport. FREE: roll 1d6 and your opponent moves America Chavez that many spaces. Star Punches: Close Combat Expert & Force Blast.
As a queer white trans woman in a relationship with a queer latinx cis woman, I just wanted to say thank you for your write up and perspective on this character. Well done.
Of course, missed opportunity by Marvel to keep her true to the comic book character and hire a Puerto Rican afro-latinx actress, but still a step in the right direction for diversity. After Marvel missed with hiring Tilda Swinton to play Ancient One, you think they’d have learned by now. I know there was also criticism of who was hired to play Moon-Knight for this same reason.
Hurling Busses: Gargantos deals +1 damage when making object attacks Flailing Tentacles: FREE: Make a Close Attack. Invisible Tracker: Capture. // Gargantos has Shape Change until the first time they take damage this game.
For the Hurling Bussed trait, why not add Super Strength to pick up heavy objects? Just a thought.
I don’t feel like the jump to villainy was as drastic as some feel. I honestly feel like WandaVision led her to this point pretty handily, and not just because of the post-credit scene of her reading the Darkhold. Yes, she released her hold on Westview, but only after intense needling and a LOT of arguing against it on her part. Remember how hard she fought against letting them go. She desperately wanted to keep her hold on them because she really wanted to keep it for herself no matter how terrible it was for everyone else.
Then there was her punishment of Agatha. That was not only cruel as Agatha called it, but sadistic to boot. WandaVision was the story of her fall from heroism to villainy, and Multiverse of Madness was the fulfillment of that arc.
ASK ME ONCE I’LL ANSWER TWICE JUST WHAT I KNOW I’LL TELL BECAUSE I WANNA!
SOUND DEVICE AND LOTS OF ICE I'LL SPELL MY NAME OUT LOUD BECAUSE I WANNA!