So its against your code to introduce new characters?

As I recall, the original Crisis introduced a few new characters. I'm sure that the Trinity will get some screen time, but dominating each issue isn't something I'm particularly interested in either.

I wasn't going to pick up my comics this week. I planned on waiting until next Wednesday and pick up two weeks worth at that time. Reading this thread intrigued me, though. One comic, in particular, stuck out. After reading it, I had to come back to the following post and wonder if he'd even read the same comic I did:

Some points:
1. There are only 8 pages in the Japanese introduction, not 10. In one of the panels, certainly not all 10 pages are they talking about taking out a monster. It is obvious to me, and I think it would be obvious to any reader, comic fan or otherwise, that the point of those pages was twofold - to introduce the DCU Japanese superhero subculture, which acts as a setting for the reintroduction of an old obscure character, Sonny Sumo.
I don't know who he is and that didn't make this any less a comic. Quite the opposite, in fact - I found his reintroduction intriguing. Your rant against this section of the comic suggests you never want to be introduced to characters you've never heard of. I assume that isn't right and that you either meant something else or were somehow unaware that this was acting as an introduction to the character.

2. Your obsession with Superman, Batman, and Wonder Woman is a little weird. When I read your post, I assumed they weren't present in the comic, but they ARE. If you didn't notice Superman or Wonder Woman in this comic, I can't believe you are doing anything more than skimming the comic. They were pretty evident to me. Even if they weren't, I don't understand why it is you expect them to be in every issue or every panel of every important event. There ARE other superheroes, you know.

3. Batman getting punked is a reason to not like this comic? You do know that despite his skills, he is NOT omniscient. He doesn't actually know everything. He does have limitations. To see him taken out by an Alpha Lantern, an agent of Darkseid, is not preposterous. I've seen the Penguin knock out Batman with an umbrella. Sure, Batman is very capable and regularly handles situations that should be beyond him. If that happens every single time, as you apparently want, then he isn't really a regular human, is he? If he isn't then he loses half his charm.

4. Alpha Lantern - you were waiting for Superman or Bats to tell her to F herself. Of course you were. I actually thought it was a nice bit of characterization for them to show her deferance, despite her caustic personality, out of respect for their friend and ally Hal Jordan. After all, it is not the first ally with whom they've worked who has an attitude.

5. The story jumps abruptly. Well, looking back, I suppose it does. You don't like that. It doesn't bother me - I didn't even notice it until I reread the comic looking for it.

6. The New Gods thing is lame, you say? Well, I guess you have an opinion. I'm sorry you missed out on so many great DC comics that you have no appreciation for them. If you are in need of an education on how non-lame these characters are, I'm sure there are many of us who know otherwise that would be happy to compile a list of some of their great stories for you to read in order to fill in that gap.

7. Your frustration about this not being a "major event" suggests you have a small, limited view on what that ought to be. A lot of comic readers, and you may be one of them, seem to define major events simply by who dies, or what was destroyed, or how many crossovers it commands. It make me worry that those people are forgetting to enjoy it as a story, because they are too concerned with seeing who dies, who is maimed, which building falls down, etc.

8. You missed so many great line in this issue!

"What does he know about us? I saved the life of an injured porpoise!"

"All of my life I waited to be a gimmick. The transformation of man into merchandising! Spirit into toy!"

"Who knew the sound of breath whistling through smashed cartilage could be such a turn-on?"

"We'll all miss him. And pray for a resurrection."

"If he promises me an end to boredom, I'll take it."

"I don't remember voting them in."

"Did you think the gods would tread lightly when they came among you?"

"Its wrong to pity the weak."

Wally - "Imagine a bullet fired backwards through time."
Jay - "Do I have to? Wally, I hate anything to do with time travel in all its forms..."

I admit to being a bit underwhelmed by issue #1, but I loved issue #2.

Actually, how about if I could care less about Morrison, but I disagree anyway?

I thought FC #2 was very fun, personally, and setting things up for nastiness later on.

Some could call the Runaways Scooby doo wannabes. It just depends what you like. And I do like the Runaways btw.

But I'm skipping FC. If it starts to turn out good, then I'll pick up the trade. So far I'm not hearing anything that says I should buy it, though.

Then you just heard it -
Buy it.

1. Because being 2 pages less then my guessmakes it less lame. And who cares about the Japanese hero population? Or Sonny Sumo for that matter?

2. Obession? They are the 3 biggest heroes ever, they should have more screen time in "huge vents". And yes i know they were in the book. You seem to take things to literally. Or you just like to nitpick. And juging by this and the 8 pages thing Im going with nitpick.

3. Duh. Im just saying it would have been nice to see Batman (or any hero really) do something interesting. But woohoo this is the day evil won! blah blah blah

4. As you may recall one of the heroes said something like "I don't remember voting them in."" Which is exactly right. Heck Batman most of all should have been telling her to piss off.

5. I guess some of us read more closely than others.

6. Nope they are pretty frickin lame. They are obviously something made in the 70s. But thats just my opinion. If you love them great. More power to ya.

7. I would enjoy it for the story but so far the story is a yawn.

8. Great lines or awful lines? Chocolate or Vanilla?

But hey its all matter of opinion. And I admit the original Crisis was a yawn the first few issues as well. Hopefully it will pick up. But so far I just plain dont like it. I think its boring. And I seriously hate the Dark Side Club garbage.

Are you serously compaing a comic that has won multiple awards and have many repritns AND is getting a movie... to an EIGHT page intro full of wannabes who are just there to introduce another character?

Really?

Final Crisis is suppose to be about more than just Superman, Batman, WW, and GL being together. That is what the Justice League title is for. I liked the intro of the young heroes of Japan. Never read a story of Sumo before so I shouldn't like him? I liked him and look forward to what Shilo has in store for him. DC's various major crossover Crisis storylines have always featured more than just characters with their own title. The first Crisis crossover was done with having focus on the lesser known characters. Dawnstar, Cyborg, Blue Beetle, ect.

I am big fan of Superman, Batman, Flash, Green Lantern, and so on. That is why I read their titles. If the comic companies never try to generate interest in their other characters then they are quit foolish. Just because a character doesn't have their own title doesn't mean they have no stories to tell. Silver Surfer had over a 150 issues on his own, Ghost Rider before the movie was very popular for awhile, Deathlok, Catwoman, and so forth.

That said I was dissappointed in F.C. 1. Then F.C. 2 hooked me for the next issue.

Which is weird because Secret Invasion 1 I liked and then S.I. 2 and 3 and the Avengers crossover showing "when" Pym was replaced killed my interest to read anything more about the Secret Invasion crossover. There is no point in trying to figure out which characters where replaced and "when" it is just forced in later. And that is my opinion. You don't like F.C.? No amount of debating will change your mind anymore than my opinions of Secret Invasion would change. What I do not understand is the mindset of only the big guns can be used to tell a story. Watchmen would never have happen if DC had that mindset.

Have you read each issue of Final Crisis already before they came out? You don't think those "wannabes" will be helping Shilo and Sumo out at all after this issue?

A Runaway movie hopefully will get made and be good. But like with so many comic movie announcements I will believe it when I see it in the theater.

Also not getting the lack of understanding Milo's post. States "And I do like the Runaways btw." I think Milo was just stating everyone has different opinions. And Milo feel free to correct me if need to.

The Runaways got their start in what issue one of their title but another young powered team can't show up in a mini series? Wow, if a team wasn't around before 2008 it don't count? Some people are going to not like the Runaways but like this new team from Japan. And some are going to dislike the Super Young Team while liking Runaways. No matter how much you hate it doesn't mean much. Do you think Final Crisis will be cancelled and rewrote to edit 8 pages out that were about the Super Young Team and then changed for more about Batman doing something you would think would be supercool? Just the way it goes.

Let me say first that I read Marvel as a kid, and never touched anything DC (though I knew who the big guns were, and have always liked Batman). When I started picking up comics again a few years ago, I started with Batman, and then moved on to other DC titles. I've stuck mainly with DC for the last few years (with the exception of most Ultimate books).

I personally think Secret Invasion is a much more enjoyable read for me. Lots of action, and you don't know what'll happen next. Mind you, for the hardcore Marvel-ite, I can understand the frustration with Marvel's ability to make anyone a Skrull and then explain it in Mighty/New Avengers a la Pym (though I enjoyed the issue and the explanation).

I started this saga with Identify Crisis, and have ready Infinite Crisis, Countdown, 52, and all the tie-ins (Rann/Thanagar, etc.). Final Crisis is definitely not what I was expecting. The art, for one, threw me off. It isn't... epic... enough. I have to agree w/DarkCrisis that the Japanese hero thing was just not good. I read the preview for this book and thought that surely the part about Japanese teen heroes was a misprint. Nope.

I have no idea who Sumo is. Not that I don't like new characters (new to me, anyway), but spending that much time in Japan sort of ruined this issue for me. I like Darkseid & Co. running around as humans, and I have no problem with Batman being so easily defeated. After all, he'll bust out and save the day later, eh?

I don't know. This issue just seemed to have no connection with the DC Universe that I've been reading for the last few years. It almost seems as if this IS some kind of Elseworlds tale. It just seems like all of this buildup in Countdown isn't directly connected to this. Yes, I can see some connections, but Countdown itself wasn't even very good, and then end was surely a letdown. It seems like this whole series (if you want to call it that) has gone downhill since Infinite Crisis, which I personally enjoyed.

I'm sure I can think of more things to say about this book, but in the end, I would give it a 6 out of 10... not HORRIBLE, has a lot of potential, but not what I'm hoping for. I'll keep reading, if only because I have a box of books from I.D Crisis to this, so I feel an obligation to
read the next few issues, at least. And Rann/Thanagar Holy War, and...

Someone pointed out that F.C. was written after Death of the New Gods. That explains something... I thought Orion died at the end of DOTNG?

Let me also say that I don't have to have the Big 3 in every panel. I love Batman, but he has his own book, and Supes and WW can come in and save the day later. But what about Donna Troy, Jason Todd, Kyle Raynor, Jimmy Olsen, etc.?

I think you mean written before DONG. Here's Morrison's exact words on the subject:

Quote : Originally Posted by Grant Morrison

Back in 2006, I requested a moratorium on the New Gods so that I could build up some foreboding and create anticipation for their return in a new form… instead, the characters were passed around like hepatitis B to practically every writer at DC to toy with as they pleased, which, to be honest, makes it very difficult for me to reintroduce them with any sense of novelty, mystery or grandeur.

If Countdown, DONG, and all the other bull#### stuff that came out doesn't sync up with FC, blame DC's editorial, not Morrison.

Morrison is not greater than DC. He gets to use their toys, he doesn't get to tell them how they should be using them.

Regardless. Final Crisis doesn't even sync up with the Fourth World, so who cares, continuity clearly isn't an issue with this title.

Yeah, regardless of who is to blame Final Crisis definitely does not sync up with the Fourth World. Hell, it doesn't synch up with the fifth, sixth, or seventh worlds either. I'm just not feeling it...