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I'm serious. This is one of many undocumented exceptions that MC has.
So if a MC a fig with MC, and use my free action to MC another fig, I could cancel things whenever I wanted because I'm making all MC power actions.
How about if I was playing against a team that had 4 first click MCers on it. I could MC 1 of them, use that fig to MC another, and so on until, given successful rolls, I control the entire team. At that point my opponent has no friendly figs on the map. That would be a cool achievement, although the only damage I would deal to my opponents figs would be any MC feedback damage those figs incurred. I'm rambling.
for the record. I don't like those exceptions, with regard to canceling things mid-MC. An action is an action. I like things consistent whenever possible.
Quote : Originally Posted by nbperp
Things which might lack clarity now will be certain to reflect those intentions.
Well, that' something! At least you responded, acknowledging the existence of my post. And I wasn't saying that defeated is losing control of a figure, I was saying that when a figure is defeated if the wildcard was copying a TA from the now defeated character, you no longer have access to the team ability. Whether losing a defeated friendly character would be similar to losing a temporarily friendly character (via mind control)l, I'm not sure, I was simply adding that it seems like a similar situation and so seemed relevant to the discussion.
None of the conditions are met that would cause the WC to not be able to use the copied TA. Therefore it doesn't matter that after the MC action you may no longer have a friendly figure with the TA.
Quote : Originally Posted by The7ofDiamonds
Quote : Originally Posted by The7ofDiamonds
At the same time, I'd also think that the way the rules are worded, that they can use a TA possessed by a friendly character during any action... and TA's go on a by action basis... I'd think that the check to see if you have a friendly character possessing that TA happens on every action, and once you no longer have that friendly character possessing the TA, you could no longer use the TA.
And I don't mean that the TA turns on and off action by action, I mean that the team ability in use is determined on an action by action basis. Meaning by default, whatever TA you used last is still being used, but when an action comes up, you can choose to use or not use the TA... and Wildcards can change whether they want to continue using the TA they used last or they can choose a new TA for that action.
You said that because TA's can be used or not on a per actio basis, that WC's should check if they can copy the TA every time an action is taken. If that's not what you meant, then ok. But then I have to ask, since you aren't disagreeing with any point made about continuos use, what exactly were you commenting on? Just to re-iterate what was already said? Once a WC copies a TA, they can use it as long as none of the conditions that end the 'copying' are met. It doesn't matter that there are no friendly figures that have the TA because that is not one of the conditions. As soon as the WC chooses not to use the TA for an action, the WC looses the ability to use the TA until conditions are met that would allow the WC to choose to use that TA.
So if a MC a fig with MC, and use my free action to MC another fig, I could cancel things whenever I wanted because I'm making all MC power actions.
How about if I was playing against a team that had 4 first click MCers on it. I could MC 1 of them, use that fig to MC another, and so on until, given successful rolls, I control the entire team. At that point my opponent has no friendly figs on the map. That would be a cool achievement, although the only damage I would deal to my opponents figs would be any MC feedback damage those figs incurred. I'm rambling.
That's perfectly fine. Just to be clear, it would not end the game, if that's what you're thinking.
Quote
for the record. I don't like those exceptions, with regard to canceling things mid-MC. An action is an action. I like things consistent whenever possible.
You're preaching to the choir.
At least two biggies were clear up with the new PAC. (Perplex and Outwit used to say that they could not be used during another action, but they were still allowed to be used during MC for some reason.)
So if a MC a fig with MC, and use my free action to MC another fig, I could cancel things whenever I wanted because I'm making all MC power actions.
Want something even better? I believe that only the character just MCed can cancel during the MC action; no other character can cancel once the MC attack begins.
Want something even better? I believe that only the character just MCed can cancel during the MC action; no other character can cancel once the MC attack begins.
You said that because TA's can be used or not on a per actio basis, that WC's should check if they can copy the TA every time an action is taken. If that's not what you meant, then ok. But then I have to ask, since you aren't disagreeing with any point made about continuos use, what exactly were you commenting on? Just to re-iterate what was already said? Once a WC copies a TA, they can use it as long as none of the conditions that end the 'copying' are met. It doesn't matter that there are no friendly figures that have the TA because that is not one of the conditions. As soon as the WC chooses not to use the TA for an action, the WC looses the ability to use the TA until conditions are met that would allow the WC to choose to use that TA.
Yeah, that's basically what I was saying. I was just stating my proposed [though not necessarily assumed correct] understanding.
I was basically just adding something to the discussion, not knowing if it would sway it one way or the other. I figured it was worth mentioning because it was similar, but understandably not the same, situation. I knew that you lose access to the TA if the friendly you're getting the TA from is defeated... I just wasn't sure on the specifics of the wording on why exactly it was lost, so I figured that lost due to being defeated and lost due to actually losing control of the figure was similar enough to warrant mentioning. If not for being correct, then at least for furthering my own understanding and validating my stance.
Forum Team Building Contest #2 and #3 Winner, & runner up for #1 and #4.
Can a wild card copy the team ability of a MCed character if that team ability is also available on its own force? For example, the opposing force has 5 characters possessing the Mystics team ability. My force has one character possessing the Mystics team ability and that character is on its last click. Can I Mind Control an opposing Mystic, declare that my wild cards are all changing to Mystics, and then have the wild card characters keep using Mystics team ability even after my character possessing the Mystics team ability is KOd?
Can a wild card copy the team ability of a MCed character if that team ability is also available on its own force? For example, the opposing force has 5 characters possessing the Mystics team ability. My force has one character possessing the Mystics team ability and that character is on its last click. Can I Mind Control an opposing Mystic, declare that my wild cards are all changing to Mystics, and then have the wild card characters keep using Mystics team ability even after my character possessing the Mystics team ability is KOd?
Off the top of my head, I can't think of a reason this wouldn't work.
Off the top of my head, I can't think of a reason this wouldn't work.
Given that, can a wild card already copying your character possessing the Mystic team ability change to the MCed character possessing the Mystic team ability? i.e., I change from the Mystic team ability to the...Mystic team ability (but from a different source)?
Given that, can a wild card already copying your character possessing the Mystic team ability change to the MCed character possessing the Mystic team ability? i.e., I change from the Mystic team ability to the...Mystic team ability (but from a different source)?
Again, I don't really see why not. The only thing that really matters is that the TA comes from a friendly character and MC takes care of that.
Again, I don't really see why not. The only thing that really matters is that the TA comes from a friendly character and MC takes care of that.
Lastly, how specific do I have to be when I do it? (I suppose I'm asking for GenCon and this question is not directed at normalview specifically -- so the answer of ask the judge is not what I'm looking for.) Can I just say...my wild cards all copy the Mystics team ability or do I need to be more specific?
So with a successful MC attack, I can turn off an opposing figs dial more or less-then get to use the same fig to attack or whatever?
Essentially yes. When you successfully Mind Control a character, you can cancel all of that character's optional powers, combat abilities, and team abilities. Just remember this must be done before you attack with the character. So if you cancel EE, you cannot use it. (At the same time, there usually isn't a reason to cancel EE. This tends to be more focused on defensive abilities.)
So with a successful MC attack, I can turn off an opposing figs dial more or less-then get to use the same fig to attack or whatever?
I don't use MC at all so that's why I ask.
You can turn off any/all optional powers, yes. But not all powers are optional and remember that if you were planning on using a particular power, you can't turn it off (kind of hard to zip around with MC'd Superman's HSS if you already cancelled it).