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I always thought giving Nightcrawler Shape Change for the Image Inducer was reaching because he never actually used that option in battle but here you've got examples of where he did. So nuts to me.
Quote : Originally Posted by M_Tuttle
I have to give Kaitouace points for hitting the nail on the head.
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So here I go adding to Kaitouace's sig again, but he hit the nail on the head. FOOM is very playable.
Really? here? now? theres like 10000000000000000 threads for this you should hunt one of them down.
Seems to me point costing is a valid question.
Most of us would like some insight on that process and Ben said he would answer questions on that.
So I will repeat...
Can you explain your experience with the point costing process?
How many itterations did you go through?
What were the point costs they sent back to you?
Did you tweak the figure based on the point costs they sent you?
What tweaks did you make?
Did you learning anything about the point costing process?
Did WK make tweaks for you?
Did you give them a point range you wanted?
Did they fill in the stats for you?
Are the SPs your own design or were they tweaked?
"A Jester unemployed is nobody's fool." - The Court Jester "And so he says, I don't like the cut of your jib, and I go, I says it's the only jib I got, baby!
My only criticisms of Ben's process are: A) use of non-comics (and thus non-"canon") reference material. Really shouldn't be done in a game based solely on the comics license.
B) not enough consideration for game balance, especially with regard to his teleport range and evacuation ability. By Ben's logic, every speedster character should be able to reach the opposite end of any map in a single move action. Similarly, while his 19 DV is appropriate as is, adding Super Senses on top of it was too much. And Shape Change to that...much too much.
Still, it's a great figure. Ben definitely did his homework (right down to issue numbers; AWESOMESAUCE) and made a great case for every ability. I particularly love the reason for the costume, though I hated that storyline. And for all the crying about his supposed undercostedness, without the first two clicks he'd be Experienced Domino...without the 6 range...or the 6 clicks of life...or the PC...and thus he'd be 40 points at the most. Probably more like 30!
He's paying FIFTY POINTS for two clicks of life, folks. So yeah...not undercosted, at least.
Is the argument of non-comics material being used even valid anymore? (Was it ever?) We have movie versions of Catwoman, Iron Man & War Machine, Jonah Hex, and an ENTIRE 25 FIGURE WATCHMEN SET, which was NOT based off the comics license, but the movie license. Non-comic material is already in heroclix, so it's not like it's anything new.
Quote : Originally Posted by Magnito
In other words, it's all Vlad's fault.
Quote : Originally Posted by Masenko
Though I'm pretty sure if we ever meet rl, you get a free junk shot on me.
Quote : Originally Posted by Thrumble Funk
Vlad is neither good nor evil. He is simply Legal.
I still think he's overdone. I may not have done as much specific research as you, but I have read tons of X-men comics and can safely say that it's comic accurate to allow Nightcrawler to be hit. I think Shape Change and Super Senses at once is just the straw that breaks the camel's back. Personally, I would have put BAMF up at the front when he's in the open and then replaced it with shape change when he retreats to the shadows, but never have both at the same time. I also would not have given him 19 defense, since the guy gets shot and stabbed on a daily basis.
In the end, it's your dream figure and not mine, but he's too over the top for me and even though I like the character and the abilities on the figure, I'd feel a little guilty putting him on my side. Next to the other X-men, he seems to be in his own league.
I'm certain if I pooled through enough Captain America comics or Spider-Man comics, etc., I could justify making a clix that was ridiculously more powerful than it should be with regards to game balance and design.
Just because you can "justify" this uber-fanboy dial, doesn't mean it's not broken from a game-standpoint.
But hey, it's not your fault for being a fanboy, it's Wizkids' fault for looking at this dial, not blinking, and saying "86 points? Sure!"
Rep.
I'm sorry, I'm a NC Fanboy, and this dial still reeks of fanboy uberism. All the citations in the world don't change that.
"I love man for all the potential that he holds, and hate men for how seldom they live up to it"
My only gripe is...Nightcrawler has been known to be fatigued after teleporting, either friendlies or enemies...I'd have reflected that by having him take a click for pulling any enemy figures out of their formations.
Are you a PbP'r (Play By Poster)? Come and check out www.creationmatrix.com; we've got EVERYTHING.
Is the argument of non-comics material being used even valid anymore? (Was it ever?) We have movie versions of Catwoman, Iron Man & War Machine, Jonah Hex, and an ENTIRE 25 FIGURE WATCHMEN SET, which was NOT based off the comics license, but the movie license. Non-comic material is already in heroclix, so it's not like it's anything new.
I'm not sure that heroclix is strictly comics related anyhow. I've never seen anything that said it was only that. Certain characters and universes/licenses may not fit very well. In this case the movie and and cartoons are representations of the comic character. I see no reason they should be excluded.
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During the design process, I play-tested my various designs. I play-tested him against a variety of teams on a variety of maps. I put him on a Martial Artist theme team and various X-Men theme teams. I also tried different feats and BFCs. At the time, it was still the restricted/unrestricted format. Wizkidsgames also play-tested with him. They tweaked my design as result of play-testing and then it was on to the costume
What did some of your earlier iterations look like?
I can only hope that if/when we get the next fan-created dial, just as much research and thought is put into that dial. I can tell you're an aggressive player because this seems to be a min/max figure (that is a compliment). Some people will gripe about the point cost, as already witnessed in this thread, but I think after some play he will be manageable. I was wondering, was your goal to create a hyper-competitive figure or was it to create as comic-accurate a dial as possible for Nightcrawler?
Not that it matters, but I think you accomplished BOTH an accurate and competitive dial. Also, what is your favorite X-Men writer? Just remember, you can never make everyone happy and you are always going to be attacked no matter what dial you give him. Be proud of what you created, it was a fantastic accomplishment and great work.
I could keep going on and on with flattery, I'm just giddy right now.
I was wondering, was your goal to create a hyper-competitive figure or was it to create as comic-accurate a dial as possible for Nightcrawler?
He mentioned in another thread that he designed Nightcrawler to discourage tentpole teams, which kind of rankled me.
Not the discouraging of tentpole teams, but the fact that one player could design a figure to affect the meta of the game to nerf a playstyle he personally doesn't like.
Longest-Reigning Drunken HeroClix Champion - anyone got a liver?
He mentioned in another thread that he designed Nightcrawler to discourage tentpole teams, which kind of rankled me.
Not the discouraging of tentpole teams, but the fact that one player could design a figure to affect the meta of the game to nerf a playstyle he personally doesn't like.
Ah, thanks for clearing that up. Rep!
*You must spread rep around...and feed the children of the world...