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Although... if I'm right then it would also seem as if he was on his last click and you KO'd him you wouldn't take 2 damage.
From the Player's Guide:
Quote
This team ability would still activate as the character is KO‘d
So yes it would still activate, but since he is KO'd (AFTER DAMAGE HAS BEEN TAKEN) he would only take 1 damage as he does not have the power.
This just makes me even more certain of my understanding.
Quote : Originally Posted by Necromagus
When I came on board as RA I brought with me a mission to meet the intent of a power/ability and a firm distaste for exploits or loopholes that circumvented the intention of a rule. That's where the Rules team comes in.
If you look at the PAC, you will see "Standard move/attack/defense/damage symbols."
Standard Symbols /= Standard Abilities.
Two different things. If his wording was Standard powers and Symbols, I would see how you could read Standard Powers and Standard Symbols. However I cannot possibly see reading it as Standard Powers and Standard Abilities when Standard Abilities is a completely undefined term. Now, if a new PAC/Rulebook comes out that has Standard Abilities listed, I will see how their could be confusion.
aqhoffman- greatest post possibly ever
jtallday- Jon I wouldn't challenge you if I wasn't sure you are wrong cuz I don't have that kind of energy.
So yes it would still activate, but since he is KO'd (AFTER DAMAGE HAS BEEN TAKEN) he would only take 1 damage as he does not have the power.
This just makes me even more certain of my understanding.
Completely agree, looked up the same PG entry when I was posting that. That entry would be completely unnecessary if the Mystics Damage was truly checked before damage was actually dealt.
aqhoffman- greatest post possibly ever
jtallday- Jon I wouldn't challenge you if I wasn't sure you are wrong cuz I don't have that kind of energy.
Here the activation is the same.
Bag-Man deals damage back after damage is applied, so Mystics would as well and since his power is showing it would deal 2.
This explanation makes the most sense to me. For what its worth I've never witnessed a game where Mystics damage was applied first: it's always been the attack damage applied first followed by the Mystics effect.
So yes it would still activate, but since he is KO'd (AFTER DAMAGE HAS BEEN TAKEN) he would only take 1 damage as he does not have the power.
This just makes me even more certain of my understanding.
But if the figure is off the board due to being KO'd, and already dealt it's mystics dmg at this point, then that means its Mystics damage was dealt DURING the attack and not after.
You turn your dmg clix when the attack action has resolved against your figure. So it would only be the ONE dmg during the attack, and 2 for each attack suffered after that.
Alex Ross hates Kyle Rayner too. I hope the Death's head sculpt is hideous and his dial is just as bad.
But if the figure is off the board due to being KO'd, and already dealt it's mystics dmg at this point, then that means its Mystics damage was dealt DURING the attack and not after.
You turn your dmg clix when the attack action has resolved against your figure. So it would only be the ONE dmg during the attack, and 2 for each attack suffered after that.
If the Mystics was dealt BEFORE the character was KO'd there would be no need for a clarification that says "This team ability would still activate as the character is KO‘d." The reason that is there is because otherwise the character would be KO'd, now there would be no TA, and hence no damage. So they clarified You still take damage even if you KO the character with Mystics.
aqhoffman- greatest post possibly ever
jtallday- Jon I wouldn't challenge you if I wasn't sure you are wrong cuz I don't have that kind of energy.
If they had wanted In-Betweener to deal out 2 Mystics damage from each time he was dealt damage,
I assume the special power would have covered the whole dial. It does not.
Therefore, I feel that the special power is checked when the damage is dealt. If In-Betweener is damaged while he is on his first click, he only deals 1 Mystics damage.
Seems fairly simple to me.
*********************************************
Another example, take a hypothetical character of 8 clicks of life with no damage reducers.
For the first 4 clicks he has no team ability.
For the last 4 clicks he has a special power that says he possesses the Mystics team ability.
He would not deal out Mystics damage until he physically possessed the special power.
So my thing is that if he was hit for 8 straight damage which KO'd him, he would deal NO Mystics damage.
If he was hit for 1 straight damage, he would deal NO Mystics damage.
And if he was hit for 5 straight damage, and landed on the special power granting Mystics, he would still deal NO Mystics damage.
"But when I think about Jason...and what I would endure to have him back..."
-Bruce Wayne, Superman/Batman # 12, Sept. 2004
If the Mystics was dealt BEFORE the character was KO'd there would be no need for a clarification that says "This team ability would still activate as the character is KO‘d." The reason that is there is because otherwise the character would be KO'd, now there would be no TA, and hence no damage. So they clarified You still take damage even if you KO the character with Mystics.
Exactly. They clarified it to mean that the Mystics dmg is taken DURING the attack instead of after the action(s) resolve. That is all that means.
Alex Ross hates Kyle Rayner too. I hope the Death's head sculpt is hideous and his dial is just as bad.
Another example, take a hypothetical character of 8 clicks of life with no damage reducers.
For the first 4 clicks he has no team ability.
For the last 4 clicks he has a special power that says he possesses the Mystics team ability.
He would not deal out Mystics damage until he physically possessed the special power.
So my thing is that if he was hit for 8 straight damage which KO'd him, he would deal NO Mystics damage.
If he was hit for 1 straight damage, he would deal NO Mystics damage.
And if he was hit for 5 straight damage, and landed on the special power granting Mystics, he would still deal NO Mystics damage.
The problem with your example is that when KO'd he would have no powers to show that he has Mystics, but on that 5 th click he does possess the power and then able to use the team ability.
Quote : Originally Posted by Necromagus
When I came on board as RA I brought with me a mission to meet the intent of a power/ability and a firm distaste for exploits or loopholes that circumvented the intention of a rule. That's where the Rules team comes in.
Interesting to note that the Deps have been around, but not popped into this thread to give an opinion one way or another yet.
Which means they most likely are not 100% certain and are having to discuss it. I've been waiting to see what they say about this matter.
P.s. that's also how I interpret it.
"Time enjoyed wasting, was not wasted."
Quote : Originally Posted by jdm61802
Its one thing to lose due to dice rolls, another due to a better player, and a whole new level when you lose because you totally forget your team strategy.
Exactly. They clarified it to mean that the Mystics dmg is taken DURING the attack instead of after the action(s) resolve. That is all that means.
I'm never said that Mystics is dealt after actions resolve, I said that Mystics deals Unavoidable damage after Damage from an attack is taken by a character. At this point the power would be showing and says that Mystics deals 2 unavoidable damage.
Quote : Originally Posted by Necromagus
When I came on board as RA I brought with me a mission to meet the intent of a power/ability and a firm distaste for exploits or loopholes that circumvented the intention of a rule. That's where the Rules team comes in.
Exactly. They clarified it to mean that the Mystics dmg is taken DURING the attack instead of after the action(s) resolve. That is all that means.
I have no problem with that. But the damage from Mystics still isn't dealt until the Mystic takes damage. So the Mystic is dealt damage, say 5 clicks, his dial is turned 5 times, now you take Mystics damage before the attack action is resolved, how much damage? Well his Special Power says 2. Is there any reason to ignore his special power? Why would you stop turning a dial when Live! or Unstoppable comes up if powers are being ignored on the dial? One of the many reasons this power doesn't wait until after actions resolve is for multi-action Actions like Flurry. It would change completely if you waited until after the Flurry resolved. So you don't, but I don't see why Flurry attack 1 caused 1 damage and Flurry attack 2 causes 2 damage when their is a power showing that says "take 2 Mystics damage" from the time that you take your first Mystics, and is still there when you take your second.
I guess I'm still not understanding the other POV. During the attack? Sure. Still after the damage is taken? Yes, otherwise you don't know if damage is taken.
aqhoffman- greatest post possibly ever
jtallday- Jon I wouldn't challenge you if I wasn't sure you are wrong cuz I don't have that kind of energy.