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I really don't think anyone is really wrong here. Doom is easily one of the most complex villains.
In FF, when doom becomes a part of the future foundation, you can definitely see that he's a proud man that has an honor code. his story arc is really good, but i love that in the end that even though valeria had promised him compensation, that he sacrificed himself anyway.
/spoiler/
On a side note. I absolutely loved the scene where he sat down with 2 infinity gauntlets!
/spoiler/
Interesting concept. I never thought of Doom's pride and honor as non-mutually exclusive. I also agree that Doom is unique due to his characters complexity. I suppose I think of Doom as less of a villain than others. For example, Doom is often equiv-elated with characters like Lex Luthor, who in essence is fueled simplistically by greed.
I can fight only for something that I love, love only what I respect, and respect only what I at least know.
Interesting concept. I never thought of Doom's pride and honor as non-mutually exclusive. I also agree that Doom is unique due to his characters complexity. I suppose I think of Doom as less of a villain than others. For example, Doom is often equiv-elated with characters like Lex Luthor, who in essence is fueled simplistically by greed.
Ignoring the debate potential RE: Lex Luthor and his motivations when properly written...
Doom, quite simply, is Doom. Not a hero, not a villain, just Doom. He's honestly best compared to an old-school Mafia don. He's a prideful, vengeful narcissist with a code of honor and ethics that no one else can quite understand. He's so obsessed with his own greatness and with revenge on Reed Richards that he's beyond attempting to explain or justify anything.
He's perfectly willing (though sometimes needing a little persuasion) to defend the world against anyone seeking to destroy it or rule it in his place. But that's really as far as his heroism extends. And if he can find a way, in defending the Earth, to take the world over himself or to gain a little power in the bargain, well, then why not?
I'd say Lawful Evil is the right alightment for him overall, but that's kinda glossing over much of his personality. He's shows himself to be a just and benevolent ruler at times, an irrational despot at others, but for the most part he does what he does for his country and his people (and himself, by extension).
Quote : Originally Posted by RCat
"I wasn't making a personal attack! I was just applying insults and idiotic generalizations to a group of people you might be a part of! You shouldn't respond to my generalizing you indirectly!"
Ignoring the debate potential RE: Lex Luthor and his motivations when properly written...
Doom, quite simply, is Doom. Not a hero, not a villain, just Doom. He's honestly best compared to an old-school Mafia don. He's a prideful, vengeful narcissist with a code of honor and ethics that no one else can quite understand. He's so obsessed with his own greatness and with revenge on Reed Richards that he's beyond attempting to explain or justify anything.
He's perfectly willing (though sometimes needing a little persuasion) to defend the world against anyone seeking to destroy it or rule it in his place. But that's really as far as his heroism extends. And if he can find a way, in defending the Earth, to take the world over himself or to gain a little power in the bargain, well, then why not?
I'd say Lawful Evil is the right alightment for him overall, but that's kinda glossing over much of his personality. He's shows himself to be a just and benevolent ruler at times, an irrational despot at others, but for the most part he does what he does for his country and his people (and himself, by extension).
Based on the way you described him after saying he's not a villains, it still sounds to me like, yeah, he's a villain when you get right down to it.
Doom cares only for Doom. End of discussion. He only saves the world when it benefits him and is forever trying to gain more and more power with which to rule the world better with. Doom is nothing more than a self serving dictator. Though still an amazing character.