You can play that card since there is only one book of moon in play right now and if you want more than one book of moon. It's terrible hand control....but for something like Morphing Jar which will net you a new hand, it works. Now you can rebuild decks based around that strategy.

The (major) difference between Darkness Approaches and Light of Intervention is that Light of Intervention has text that SPECIFICALLY defies the rules. Nowhere in Darkness Approaches does it say that if the monster is put in facedown attack position, it can still attack. The only rule that Darkness Approaches "breaks" is the rule of monsters only being able to be in defense when facedown.

With that being said, I have my own question. If your monster is in facedown attack position because of Darkness Approaches, can you still manually flip it faceup? And if so, would it be considered a Flip Summon? On page 15 in rulebook 6.0, it specifically says a Flip Summon is from facedown DEFENSE to faceup attack, which is why I'm wondering if you could manually flip it at all.

Which goes with my theory that this card gives a special circumstance to the whole rules on face down monsters. I personally think that it should be considered a flip summon and also that it should be able to attack. I am still waiting for this to be answered by the powers that be. I sent in the question to the judge list on monday and I did it again today since there was no response to the first one I sent in.

Gawd whats so difficult to understand the rules say no so be quite....


No matter how much you want to attack with face down mon its not happening so plz let it die.

you can't play a monster in face-down attack anyway :grin:

This is why it helps to read the whole thread.

i did.....after posting... :laugh:

The rules don't say no. It won't be settled by anyone on here.

the rules do say no, they say "face up attack monster", which means only FACE-UP ATTACK POSITION monsters can attack

You actually mean, you "dont want it to be settled" here. But common sense dictates that a face-down monster cannot attack. There is no prededence to even suggest this is possible.

Additionally, a face-down monster in Attack Position can be Flip Summoned. It doesnt just apply to face-down defense monsters going face-up. There are basic Game Rules that apply to monster positions on the field.

Face-down Attack Position is NOT a Basic Game Rule, as it is not something you can routinely do without a effect. Notice the word "effect". There is no effect that allows a face-down monster to attack, whether it is in defense or attack position.

There will always be a exception to the rule, but this is not one of them, and submitting it to the Judge List will most likely result in a personal reply back, rather than posting it so that all the world can see that someone "just had to ask".

Can the monster be manually flipped up the same turn that it is flipped into face down atk mode? Even if the card was summoned or has changed positions manually? Darkness Approches states that it does change the battle position of the card. This leads me to believe that you can simply flip the card right back up if it's in Facedwon atk position, seeing that your technically not changing battle positions.

I believe this as well.

For example if I played Darkness Approaches and flipped my atk mode magician of faith into set attack mode. The same turn I could manually flip it because Darkness Approaches text says that the card's battle position is not changed.

At any rate, you are still allowed "one manual position change" per turn of a monster that has been on the field for more than one turn, and has not Battled, so it makes no difference if the monster changed Battle Positions, since it was done by an effect. You would still be allowed to flip it face-up.

The face down attack position exception on darkness approaches is only there so that when the monster is attacked, it will be flipped face-up and its ATK value rather than its DEF value will be used for damage calculation.

That's how common sense would have one interpret it. However I do understand how its very frustrating when these things aren't worded clearly and you are stuck with the pickle. I hope someone answers the question on the judge list so you get some closure, but in general all you get is useless dribble, opinion and a lot of "Konami Said So".

well is there anyone here as a level 2 or higher judge? If so, what would your ruling be?