Anyone notice Magic Blast now ignores terrain modifiers? So a figure on hindering elevated terrain wont get the +2 defence boost when hit by magic blast, also it ignores constructed terrain modifiers. It made magic blast more leathal then it was.

Could you possibly land a magically levitated enemy into deep water terrain. It says that they can't end the movement in blocking terrain, but nothing about water. Where's the terrain rules?

"Deep water terrain is considered blocking terrain for all movement purposes" DANG... Thought maybe one slipped by. Nice job WIZKIDS!

Magic blast always ignored terrain modifiers...This is nothing new.

Great new rules. Looks good. We still need some rulings on Titans and Multi-Dials. My guess is they can only be used in Conquest or point totals exceeding some number. They will probably release that with a Conquest rules sheet.

wow as I said IM impressed. they went all out and did a great job on this.

now, acknowledging that I am most likely going to be flamed and hated (like IM not already) I shall promptly defend these rules.

for one I own 1682 orcs. guess how many suddenly became so much more useful. all but the gorgers bersekers and grenadiers who, thanks to force march, don’t get hurt that much anywise. now IM looking forward to playing my horde as long as I play mageknight and theirs nothing that I can see that makes any of them (yep even the berserkers) useless or obsolete(but then to most of you orcs are already obsolete huh?). I will hit on the main arguments below (makes self target for hate)

1. formations between completely different factions argument. you know the only time I ever thought bout moving in formation with two different (no0n-shyft)factions was when I got my special draconum pyre spirit. really even thou they may have close to a similar name or even faction symbol but there different (I first realized this when I noticed the serrated edges on the OK symbol).I have 3 very apparent 'orc' unique and about 12 different 'orc' nons that cant be in formation with any other 'orc' but snake. do I care... well no, snake rocks especially now in 2.0, but that aside I don’t mind cause well there orcs. OK that aside there two different ideological organizations bent on world conquest. if you want a explanation via story wise well... here goes (oo all explanations must be orc).. the orc raiders gathered and set off south to pillage lead by Kzar Nabar. after a successful campaign the horde split while in preska. it was shattered by the treacherous solonavi swine at the gates of the atlantean empire and 5000 innocent orcs were butchered by the hateful racists evil and un-charasmatic atlantean empire. the remaining orcs south (or the orc khans) are the orcs that are cut off from the fist and the orcs staying in preskia. now lets say a gulthak orc and three berserkers meet up (it can happen) now while they will raid together the gulthak orc will not be in sync with the berserkers cause he’s been separated from them for so long (yes, they could even be brothers. time does terrible things to a orc).

point 2~ charge and bound. charge is a free surge, bound is even more powerful. this is a point where something was sacrificed in 2.0 to allow play balance. The good thing is that everything’s that’s mounted and has these abilities isn’t changed at all. Think about this for a second. Everything else has to give one click to surge or double time, assuming it has 10 clicks that’s giving up 1/10th of its life just for the opportunity to attack one turn faster. In addition they take the click after they move. Surge is like a bad version of charge. Its faster sure but in my play test its very risky unless used right. With charge you don’t lose anything. Now something can surge form 14 (solonavels) away but incase they do doesn’t it seem prudent to have a charger near by so you can counter attack without the risk of having it be a useless action? I don’t have to say anything bout bound cause well.. moving and shooting is already powerful and no less in 2.0.

point 3~how the heck does 2.0 "completely bag on older players??" how is a entire collection worthless??? now that the new rules are here lets look at what we can see are problem areas. OK what are 2.0 figures going to get that 1.0 ones don’t have. Nexus combinations, new exciting abilities and proficiencies. And they’ll be in different factions. Now lets look at what whirlwind figures got that lancers figures didn’t. New exciting abilities, new combinations of abilities not seen before, and a new faction and ‘humanoid race.’ I don’t know about you but I didn’t see a rule that said "when ever a 2.0 warrior targets a 1.0 warrior add +3 to the attack roll and +3 to damage." If anything I saw more use’s for old figures outside of conquest. Hey you know the bone grinder, well he’s better! How abbot the orc slushier, or crusher. With gang up everyone pitches into the fun! And what better is that 1 goblin runner and 5 goblin volunteers can surround a phalanx and attack with a 11, three times(proper push-surging required before base contact as always)!!!

Point three~ me being negative or another reason why this post is going to be deleted

all you out there that are getting out of mageknight ill but all your orcs for 10 cents each(cause there useless don’t cha know). Those that don’t want to take me up on my generous offer… well I understand why your scared, but this is better then haven the game discontinued. This is in fact a lot better because not only can you still use your old figs but really, despite what has been said, it really hasn’t changed that much(yes I read the new rules). Sure now theirs a lot more flair and such, and the game will pick up speed...but…its really still about what mage knight has always been about. Using cool armies to duke it out with another player. Only now its in some ways more realistic, and thugs will die easier (compared to other miniature games and computer games the kill count is still less). Also now that the rules are available for printing up online, you never have to buy a single booster or starter for mageknight ever again, ever (wow WK isn’t going to like that). You can collect al the old figures you want and play with them to your hearts content (I know I will).
(now for the real negative part, close your eyes if your sensitive to ultra violent lights or are squeamish)
what IM noticing lately is a lot of dissatisfaction and outright fear of change. People finding general reasons to disapprove of something when the reason there doing so seems more specific and personal (can we have partisan politics in Mage knight?). not to mention that but it seems each of them has this evil icky signature that’s depressing and sad, and iv always been against that’s far as I can remember.

So I say to all you negative nellies out there *sticks tongue at you*

So I can't put Darkwing Zombies and Rancid Bloodsuckers in formation anymore? Where the heck is the sense in that? My Gyre Falcons can't flock?? Great rules set except for that little matter.
I like shockwaving in B2B, I can forgive the necromancy change with some help from hex and summon, even charge/bound can (mostly) be fixed with forced march, but I don't understand the flight thing! Ok to not make it optional (for doubletime purposes), fine I understand that, but could someone please explain the justification in not allowing formations at all??
This isn't so much negativity as just struggling to understand...
:confused: :confused: :confused:

Draddog has confirmed (it might have been over on the official forums) that old faction and new factions (like Atlantis Guild and Atlantean Empire) CANNOT make any kind of formations together. In his post he stated that it was a hard decision to reach, and that WizKids will evaluate and possibly change this after 2.0 releases.

Now, I understand what they're trying to do with the storyline and how most of these factions have split... and hey, fiction is cool and all, and I have to give kudos to WizKids for writing up some decent stories to explain these changes... but...

Mage Knight is a game. There are a lot of us who have been spending a lot of money on this game for years. Storyline or no, the fact that 2.0 more or less abandons the majority of our current collections... well, it's a problem. I understand that WizKids wants an entry point for new players to the game, but I wonder if they've considered the possibility of losing veterans of the game because of some of these changes.

Which is really unfortunate, because I'd say I'm about 90% happy with the 2.0 rules and abilities as they are right now. It's definitely a better game than the current one, but the focus on storyline over gameplay is a problem for me.

Excellet points Vulture ... I definitely agree with you on a whole lot of counts. That's the part I really don't uderstand much about the old players in fear of change.... not when the 1.O figures got a WHOLE lot better . Well yes, not ALL of them.. but a great MAJORITY have definitely gotten better. hehehehe and not just for ORCs mind yah.

Change is good. 2.O is Godsent

flight vs soaring figs - Flight figs can control objectives... soaring figs.. you see they can't.... and what's the purpose of gameplay in 2.O? yes... it's to control the MOST objectives.

I am sorry that some people see the 1.0/2.0 formation rule as determinative as to whether they will play 2.0. Personally, I think this is a mistake--the formation thing has been blown way out of proportion. I have been a single faction Atlantis player for over two years, and this rule does not bother me. Frankly, with the lack of use of formations, and with people picking and choosing figures from all of the factions, I wonder why so many people are upset. It almost seems to them to be a symbolic thing--the alleged abandonment of their 1.0 figures by WizKids. I do not see it that way. In fact, one can look at it the other way around. The 2.0 figures are hurt by not being able to formation with 1.0 figures.

1.0 figures will very much be viable. In fact, the thing I fear more are new players using only 2.0 figures getting trounced by people using 1.0 and 2.0 figures. Pole arm, magic blast, multiple arrow F/L, magic freeze (yes, magic freeze) among other things prove 1.0's continuing viability.

Dude, you misread a couple of these, I think. I like the improvement to magic freeze (full damage with a possability of freezing) AND the shockwave change too. Now it deals pushing damage, which can never be reduced ever, so theres no arguments about invulnerables or whatever being able to avoid it's effects.

I do, however, think that strong flier is utterly useless.

quote:
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2. Ok, anyone else remember that one thing WK said, "This is NOT a new game, its simply an upgrade.... yada yada"

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No.
I have always clearly stated that this is a new game. Your old pieces work, but it's still a new game. New game new game new game.
And hat's what it's been since day 1.

Draddog, *YOU* may have always been quite clear that it was a new game, or as some posts have gone, a *NEW MAGE KNIGHT* (which is a considerably different think than a new *game*), but that hasn't always been the way it has been sold to us. Shockshifter isn't the only one who remembers things, that if they didn't come out and say it was a *new game* instead of a *new Mage Knight*, they outright insinuated it as in this post from a previous thread:

Is it still called Mage Knight?

For the purposes of differentiating it from the previous version of Mage Knight we referred to the product internally as Mage Knight 2.0 or “Washington” but the name on the box will always be Mage Knight. All versions play with the new rules, and it’s all Mage Knight.

or this quote from Weisman, in which MK isn't a new game at all but a redesign:

“Now Mage Knight is more exciting, more action-packed and more fun than ever,” said Jordan Weisman, founder and CEO of WizKids, LLC. “We’ve learned a lot in the past three years, from players and from our other games, and we’ve incorporated all our learning into the Mage Knight redesign.”

from this thread in which the term "All New Mage Knight" is headline:

http://www.mkrealms.com/forum/showth...knight+AND+2.0

When the term *new game* IS used, it isn't even clear that WK means *new game* as in completely and utterly new:

The revamp incorporates more than three years’ worth of worldwide tournament and play experience acquired by the company since the game’s release in 2000. While the mechanics of play remain the same, nearly everything else about Mage Knight has been updated. There are new game pieces, new rules, new victory conditions, and a new combat dial. In addition, Unique-level figures can be custom-equipped for every battle. The entire redesign has been accomplished while still retaining the playability of the more than 40 million Mage Knight figures already sold, as all figures from previous versions of Mage Knight will be 100% playable in the new game.

Using words like "revamp", "redesign", and "previous version" or even "the mechanics of play remain the same" don't lead anyone reading that press release to think "new game" in the way you mean it above.

I understand *you* didn't write the press release, WK did. But at least don't tell us what we heard from WK isn't true.

jmo
guacamole

Well, I like 90% of the rules and I think they are great, but there are some things that I cannot forgive. Things I will sure not use in play.

Things like the shyft rules, the multi-target damage rules, regeneration of 1 allways, magic freeze with full damage, and other some changes in the SA rules are more than nice, but...

All things about flying, formations between old and new factions, and over all: Charge and Bound.

No, no, no!!! Somebody has said that charge is a free surge proficiency but I don't agree. surge proficiency is for move all your movement value and then make a close combat attack, taking a click of damage for most figures, but charge??? it is a SA that you pay in points when you build your army, and (not to mention the formations issue for charge and bound) you have to notice that most figures (even mounted!) from 1.0 that have charge have 4, 5, 6 movement... if you disable the Charge SA you only can move 4, 5 or 6!!?!??! The new SAC don't let you double your movement value when you don't make an attack!!!!!

Sure I'm going to pass over some rules in 2.0. That keeps me out of play with people out of my close friends that use other rules, but well, the rest of the rules are really greater than I hoped.

Hey Wizkids... you've done a pretty nice job with 2.0, despite all my suspicions, but... a little changes and I think that you'll have ALL OF US (veterans and newbies) deep into your pocket.

Think it twice, and thanks for reading.

When I read the wording on Strong Flyer, I imediately came up with the following 'broken' tactic.

Turn 10 - Red Impaler pushes up to base my Rock Griffon (Who has Strong Flyer and Charge of 10).

Turn 11 - Rock Griffon moves 10 inches to base an opposing figure. He then uses Charge to attack the figure. By the rules of Strong Flyer, the Impaler also moves 10 inches and has to end his move in base contact with the Griffon, but it says no where he can't base enemy figures, so I set him in base contact with 2. Instant Ram, which ends the Impaler's Move. That single Action ends, and since the Impaler was allready pushed, he doesn't get another action token. At the end of the Turn, since the Impaler was not given an action or an action token (The Action was the Rock Griffon. The Impaler was just along for the ride.) the Impaler clears.

Turn 12 - Impaler may take an action. The Rock Griffon could also take an action if he wanted to push.

Try this trick with any Rammer, even Mounted figures (Since Nothing says you can't carry them). Pyre Spirits will love this tactic as much or more than the Impalers. The Tactic actually doesn't require the carried figure to be pushed at the start, it just works 'better' in my opinion.

I keep telling myself, "It'll be okay..."

So Necromancy takes a big hit, risking the loss of your figures altogether. That's okay, I can still run my Necropolis hordes to great effect. I have all those Feral and Rancid Bloodsuckers, and Screeching Terrors. Plus Vladd and Uhlrik have always been favourites, not to mention Fell Reapers...

Oh wait, now Flight is no longer optional, and can't be used in formation. Hmmm, well that's okay, I can still go into battle with my, ummm, uh, hmmm, oh Nightstalkers! Yeah, that's it. I don't really need all those Zombies, Skeletons, Necromancers, Feral Bloodsuckers, Rancid Bloodsuckers, Screeching Terrors, Fell Reapers, Nightmare Reapers, Nightmare Banshees, and Vampire uniques. I can still use my Nightstalkers...

Hooray...:rolleyes: