Woot! Reign of Terror got better ;)

This is how I initially felt but Mitchell_W, who is now a UDE NetRep has confirmed from UDE that in order to make a team attack illegal, you have to make ALL attackers illegal.

Basically the rule is... removing one attacker from a team attack (by making them illegal before exhaustion or by removing them from the attack after exhaustion) does not stop the team attack.

Removing an attacker is not the same as making an attacker illegal prior to the start of the attack.

It's important to recognize the timing of this issue. I'm speaking of the window between attack declaration and attack initiation. The declaration puts an effect on the chain that says "if this attack is still legal when I resolve, initiate the attack."

A member of the attacking team being made illegal prior to resolution of that effect negates the effect when it checks for legality as all members of a team must legally target the proposed defender.

Therefore, the attack is canceled.

Zaxx:

Okay... remember I said 'basically' because I was trying to cover both cases.

1. During Attack Declaration: If any proposed attacker and defender are still legal, exhaust the proposed attacker.

2. During Attack: If all attackers are removed from the attack, the attack does nothing.

Remember, I was arguing your same point prior to Mitchell's ruling. I agree that if one member of the team attack is illegal than the entire attack should be illegal but that's not how UDE has ruled it.

And by making a proposed attacker illegal prior to the start of the attack is pretty much the same as removing the proposed attacker from the proposed attack. I'm not talking about removing him from play, I'm talking about removing him from the proposed attack.

I think we are just arguing semantics here.

I think there's been a misunderstanding somewhere. I've yet to see any UDE reps state that attacks of any type with illegal attackers are allowed to commence beyond declaration.

Can you provide a cite?

This was going on late last night on this thread:

http://vsrealms.com/forum/showthread...=&pagenumber=2

I think we need Alex to chime in here.

Okie, lets go over this again from scratch.


Notice, you do NOT get to respond prior to putting the effect on the chain, there is no possible way for the opponant to stop the declaration from going onto the chain.

AFTER step 2 is your time to play effects that would exhaust attackers.


In the case of a team attack, you have to make ALL the attackers illegal to completely cancel the attack. If there is at least one, the attack continues.

All the quotes are from Mitchell, the official Net Rep for UDE

Now show me where team attacks are referred to in any of that.

The team is a single attack. Either it is legal or it isn't, there is no "mostly legal". When the games checks the legality of the proposed attack prior to actually initiating it, the game finds that one or more attackers are illegal thus making the entire attack illegal. The attack cannot proceed.

You seem to be confusing removing attackers prior to initiation with making them illegal. The two are not the same at all.

Removing an attacker allows the attack to proceed. Making an attacker illegal does not.

Chad's post here is the correct interpretation.

After declaring a team attack, but before attackers exhaust, if one of the team attackers is exhausted, the attack still goes through. That character that is now an illegal attacker does not get the "attacker" characteristic, and does not contribute to the ATK/DEF comparison during the Attack Outcome.

The attack is still considered a Team Attack. The attack will not cause Breakthrough Endurance Loss(unless it was a Team Attack Attacking Directly).

How can you exhaust an attacker before the attack begins? Are you saying I can declare a team attack, activate an attacker (or exhaust him via some other effect) and push the attack through?

If so, I'm going to start abusing this in a most degenerate fashion.

Of course you can exhaust a would-be attacker before they exhaust to attack, but then that character doesn't get to be an attacker or part of the team attack. The point is that would-be team attackers can exhaust like this, but if at least one of them is still ready and able to attack the team attack will go ahead, minus the disqualified chars.
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Yamaha shs-10 history

Very well then. I stand corrected.

(I'm sitting if truth be told but you know what I mean)

Finally. Now I can sit down too.

Lets see if I can restate the steps relating specifically to team attacks in a different way to help make it more clear.

1. Declare PROPOSED team attackers. At this time it is NOT on the chain. The game will look at your proposed attackers and proposed defender to insure they are legal. IF they are legal, procede to step 2.

2. This is the where the effect will go onto the chain. At this time they are STILL proposed attackers and propsed defenders. This is when you can do something to make one or all of the attackers illegal. When the effect resolves it will look at all the remaining proposed attackers and defender. If the defender and at least ONE attacker is still legal, it will exhaust the legal attackers and give them the "Attacker" Characteristic and give the proposed Defender the "Defender" characteristic.

There is "break" if you will in the attack sequence so to speak. This is were players will have the opportunity to respond and place effects onto the chain. Once all players pass with an empty chain, the attack sequence will continue. This is a defenders last opportunity to "stop" the attackers. The attackers could be stunned and/or removed from the game, returned to owners hand, or KOed in some way. Once all players pass on an empty chain, move on to step 3.

3. The game will check again to see of there is still a defender and at least 1 attacker, if so it will resolve the attack with the remaining attackers. If the defender is missing, the attackers will re-ready and the attack sequence is over. If the All the attackers are missing, then the attack sequence is over. If at any time the "Team Attack" is reduced to 1, it is still a team attack with any benifits or penelities that apply to a Team Attack.