That's EXACTLY the problem. I couldn't find the damn words to express it, but boy, did you nail it.

4.0 is very restrictive in nature to what you can and cannot do with your character, and your character build. Which is something I don't really like about it. Of course, it is very much like a video game RPG in that it is restrictive like that, but...yes....Bottlenecked. That's a perfect fit for how it feels.

Now, don't get me wrong, that can be just as much a pro as it can be a con. And we all know that the pros are pretty evident: Teamwork, less rules BS, everyone is more capable, etc. And those are things that are important to me, and make it so that I can easily enjoy a 4.0 game.

But, sometimes I want what works best for me. And the only true way to do that is to have the variety that 3.5 offers.


Like I said before, I'm completely indecisive when it comes to 3.5/4th. I like them both equally.

I'm looking through the classes discussed on WOTC's forums, and I'm seeing 4 additional classes to the ones in the PHB.

I'm curious as to what you're talking about.

Case in point:

There are 29 races to choose from currently.

18 character classes.

Nearly 100 Backgrounds to choose from, with variations among them.


Add to that the fact that each class has differing build options and the combos are pretty extensive.

The differences between a Human Tempest fighter with a 'Birth - Among Other Race' background and a cross class feat into Rogue and say, a Dwarf Battlerager Vigor Fighter with 'Society - Noble' for their background is pretty extensive. While they are both basically 'Defender' class, they would play very differently.

That doesn't even touch on Hybrid classes, which are new and upcoming.

I'm just saying that if what you want is deversity, it's there.

PHB added 8 classes: Avenger, Barbarian, Bard, Druid, Invoker, Shaman, Sorcerer and Warden.

Forgotten Realms PHB added the Swordmage.

Dragon magazine added the Artificer.

The only other class I have heard of that is upcoming is the Monk. I'm sure there will be more. The Ebberon PHB should add some stuff and Dragon magazine is good for at least half a dozen cool additions per year.

I would happily play and back up Dm if needed

What PHB? I own the PHB, and those classes aren't in it....

I'm confuzzled.....

Sorry. That should read PHB 2!

The new Players Handbook that came out last month. Adds the Primal power classes along with some new Arcane power and Divine power classes.

What the....

Oh dear, I need to find some PDF files, don't I?

Just do this:

http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x...aracterbuilder

Try out the character builder. (I'm sorry)

except that wizards pulled them as they discovered that the pirated copies outnumbered the actual sales

Yeah. You probably do.

There's a LOT of options out there now.

nvm..............

Talked with Prof Dresser tonight, he's never played D&D, and would be very much up for playing a 4th edition game online with us.

Have you had a chance to check out the new classes yet? I wondered if Swordmage was a bit of what you were looking for.

Also, I have a local guy that is not on the Realms that may want to join any online gaming madness.

I haven't checked out the classes, no.

I'm much more concerned at the moment about DM status.

I think it's safe for me to say that, outside of someone here being completely unemployed and single, that I have the most free time out of any of us to DM.

My problem is that, while I enjoy DMing, I like playing more. And on top of this, my experience as a DM is very limited.