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thank you for this. i am new to the game and have only played with my cousins two diff decks im planning on buying my own cards next time i get off my lazy butt and get to a store.but i picked up on Vs very quickly my cousin and his friends couldnt belive it. they think its my MTG back ground. but thank you again omni this will help me decide my deck. i was thinking of maybe a TT/BHood deck. anyone got some input on that.
Because it's been a while and Omni seems to have disappeared, I'm just gonna do the Man of Steel writeups. (Come back, Omni!)
T E A M S U P E R M A N
The greatest hero of them all gets his own VS team, with no less than five versions of himself, plus three different Supergirls and all the rest of his best-known allies.
STRENGTHS
Flight and Range - Team Superman has ridiculous amounts of both. This isn't a team filled with martial artists, like some - Team Superman is filled with people who fly and make things go foom, and most of the best characters on the team have both flight and range, thus giving Team Superman decks the best of both worlds for both offensive and defensive formations.
Character Redundancy - Thanks to Man of Tomorrow, Superman: Red and Cadmus Labs, the average Team Superman deck has anywhere from 12 to 20 cards in it named "Superman" - which are all thus power-ups for your Supermen.
Invulnerability And Defensive Tech - Team Superman is one of the most defense-oriented DC teams, with great defensive abilities on cards like Clark Kent, Kal-El, Steel and Supergirl. Furthermore, Team Superman has the most access to Invulnerability of any team in the game, which means less stun damage.
Offensive Replacement And Filtering - With cards like Daily Planet, Perry White and Kon-El, you can wreak pure havoc on your opponent's deck and resource row - and resources he doesn't get to play (and better yet, resources that get replaced with valuable characters or equipment) are advantages for you.
WEAKNESSES
Cosmic - Team Superman has a plethora of characters with Cosmic, which means they have a lot of characters with really awesome abilities UNTIL they get stunned, at which point said characters become mostly blank slates. Successful play of Team Superman thus relies on knowing when to sacrifice a character to a stun and lose their Cosmic for field advantage, which makes the team tactically difficult to play.
It's All About Big Blue - with no real way to tutor for a character other than Superman, Team Superman decks tend to be forced into playing at least one copy of him at every drop. This lends the team a certain predictability.
PLAY STYLE
The primary deck to have emerged out of Team Superman is "Phantom Phone Booth" (dubbed by Matthew Meyers), which is a curve beats deck that plays Superman at every drop possible (three through eight, since Man of Tomorrow can tutor for Superman: False Son despite him not being a Team Superman character) and abuses the power of Phantom Zone to either mess with many key cards in a number of decks (Garth in Teen Titans, Reconstruction Program in Sentinels, Jean Grey in X-Stall, Avalon Space Station in lots of decks, et cetera) or cycle through your resources more quickly when you're not playing one of those decks (since it can replace itself at your leisure). It's proven to be a reliable, competitive deck in tournament play.
KEY CARDS - CHARACTERS
Gangbuster, Miguel Delgado - a 3/2 2-drop is perfectly average, but when you realize that he can stun two Army characters in a single drop, suddenly Gangbuster becomes a deadly threat against Sentinel decks.
Superman, Red - If you get odd initiative, Red will attack at least once with 8 ATK (huge on turn 3). More importantly, his remove-Superman's-uniqueness ability is key to a curve deck with multiple Supermen in it.
Superman, Clark Kent - prevents your opponents from attacking down the curve on turn 4 (or whenever), or alternately in the latergame forces them to attack down the curve. And he's a perfectly solid 7/7 with flight and range to boot.
Superman, Kal-El - a high-statted (13/12) attacker who with his ability can both reinforce and invulnerabilize a defender, Kal-El is a seriously powerful swing card.
Eradicator, Soul of Krypton - a monstrously nasty 15/15 beast who removes the characters he stuns from the game. Not KO them - they just vanish.
Superman, Man of Steel - the endgame, a monstrous 20/20 who hands out Invulnerability to anybody who needs it, which can severely disrupt your opponent's ability to lower your Endurance to the point where he can win.
OTHER CHARACTERS OF NOTE:
Lois Lane, Star Reporter - She's a Twist of Fate! She's a 1-drop! She's both, and she can be played for free! Played on turn 1, she creates hand advantage; played any other time in addition to your drop, she's character-dig for you.
Linda Danvers <> Supergirl, Matrix - an enormous 7/6 with flight and range who can't attack other 3-drops, but then again, given that she can take out 4-drops with ease, not so small a disadvantage.
Cir-El <> Supergirl, Daughter of Tomorrow - a helpful 5-drop who usually shows up at a 10/9, Cir-El also serves as a method of regenerating Cosmic counters in an emergency.
Kara Zor-El <> Supergirl, Last Daughter of Krypton - a powerful attacker who can give your front-row Team Superman characters invulnerability while attacking means the capability to swing into a stun while attacking upwards and take no damage, or to protect, be reinforced, and take no damage. On turn 6, that's fantastic.
Superman, False Son - hey, wait, he's a Darkseid's Elite character! Yeah, but you can tutor for him with Man of Tomorrow, giving you better odds to hit your 7-drop, and that's deeply valuable to you. Besides, he's still a 16/14 with flight and range and a universally applicable ability.
KEY CARDS - PLOT TWISTS
Man of Tomorrow - the only real tutor Team Superman has, and it only gets you Superman. Luckily you can cover just about every major drop with it, and you've got multiple methods of making sure all your Supermen stay on the board to boot.
Super Speed - Sacrificing a cosmic counter can be pricey, but getting an extra attack on turns 3 through 5 (and sometimes 6) is frequently worth it, and that's precisely what Super Speed does, allowing Team Superman extra board control - for a price.
KEY CARDS - LOCATIONS
Cadmus Labs - Not only is it another method of rendering all your Supermen non-unique so you can play more of them, but in a pinch you can replace it to give a Superman an extra power-up. That can swing games.
Phantom Zone - the best location Team Superman has, and one of the best in the game, making all those cards that rely on KO pile interaction practically useless. Imagine the look on an Underworld player's face when he sits across the table from a Team Superman deck and this shows up on turn two. It's not pretty.
KEY CARDS - EQUIPMENT
Entropy Aegis Armor is pretty bad. Trust me on this.
DO THEY WIN, AND WHY?
Generally speaking, yes. Phantom Phone Booth is a solid curve beats deck that has methods to beat most of the major tournament decks of the moment. In practice, PPB is a somewhat finicky deck to play, requiring a lot of finesse and playskill, so it doesn't show up that widely at tournaments, but when it's in the hands of a skilled player it's a very, very strong deck indeed, and the deck has finished strongly at a number of major tournaments.
CONCLUSION
Team Superman is far from being the easiest deck to play and build, but the evidence is all there - it's a competitive deck that can go all the way and compete with just about everything in the game. If you're up for a challenge, up for playing a deck that requires thought and consideration, then Big Blue might be the deck for you.
N E W G O D S
The heroes of Jack Kirby's legendary Fourth World comics have their own team, and what a team it is. Some of the toughest cosmic-level hombres in the DC Universe form this flexible and powerful team.
STRENGTHS
Counter Tech - The New Gods have more counter tech than just about any faction, with the possible exception of the Gotham Knights. The Source, Metron, Orion-8, lonar, Himon - lots of options abound for the New Gods player.
Beatdown Tech - The New Gods also have a decent array of smash in their lineup, with cards like Astro-Force, Big Barda, Big Bear and the possibility of an early-appearing Infinity Man.
Regeneration Tech - New Genesis, Beautiful Dreamer, and Izaya are all great cards for making sure your New Gods stay alive and healthy.
Teamup Flexibility - Royal Decree provides the card advantage that popular teamups like Common Enemy or Brave and the Bold do. Except that Royal Decree works for the New Gods and any other faction.
WEAKNESSES
Cosmic Reliance - More than any other team, the New Gods live and die by their Cosmic counters. Moreso even than Team Superman, because New Gods characters are generally subpar without their Cosmic counters - cf. Big Bear, Fastbak, or Mark Moonrider for examples thereof.
Discard Costs - The New Gods have some exceptionally powerful tricks up their sleeve. The problem is that many of their best tricks require the discard of a New Gods character card. This can make those tricks real pricey, real fast.
PLAY STYLE
No dominant New Gods deck has yet emerged. A few clever NG teamups have started to crawl out of the woodwork - most notably with Doom and/or the Gotham Knights to create uber-control decks - but the tournament-competitive pure New Gods deck is not yet around.
Two builds have distinguished themselves early in terms of playtest, however: the dedicated Forever People deck (designed to play the Forever People characters and use Forever People to pop out more of them so you can play Infinity Man on turn 6 or even 5), and the Takion-jump deck (designed to control the field until turn 6, use Takion to skip turn 7, and then pop out a monster 8 drop earlier than expected). Neither is yet tournament competitive, however.
KEY CARDS - CHARACTERS
Vykin, Forever People - exhaust the other side's weenies? That's a good deal on turn 2, and it helps you swing the field on turns 3 and 4.
Himon, Enigmatic Researcher - he shows up and suddenly you can't Flying Kick, Acro Dodge, or Death In The Family - among many, many others. A fantastic inhibiting card. Keep him alive through turn 3 and you can completely disrupt a number of decks.
Izaya <> Highfather, Inheritor - a living Children of the Atom with above-average DEF and range, Izaya is a staple in most New Gods builds at the 4-drop.
Metron, Time Traveler - a solid 7/10 with flight and range and a built-in Fizzle - more solid than most people realize.
Big Barda, Barda Free - a 12/12 with range is perfectly average, but a 12/12 who can jump to 16/16 in a pinch is fantastic curve-jump. Paying half your endurance can be pricey when you're winning the game, but if you're losing, it's cheap.
OTHER CHARACTERS OF NOTE
Mark Moonrider, Forever People - a one-time burn for 5 is nothing to sneer at. Of course, his 3/4 stats are something to sneer at. But if you can manage two shots with him, ouch...
Lonar, Explorer - A 7/7 with built-in Night Vision on your opponent's deck, plus you can pay 3 Endurance to send cards to the bottom. Extremely solid.
Scott Free <> Mister Miracle, Escape Artist - If you're playing even initiatives (and Big Barda seems to scream out "play even initatives"), Mr. Miracle is your 5-drop of choice, just because when you're being attacked, ain't nobody who can get through his ridiculous amount of defenses - a "go home" ability plus Evasion means he's going to stick around more often than not.
Takion <> Highfather, Josh Saunders - Do you want to skip turn 7? Takion can do that for you. Do you want to skip turn 9? Takion can do that too. Takion universally accelerates the game, and if you build your deck around his ability, that means you can play Imperiex when everybody else is maybe planning to drop an 8-drop.
Orion, Dog of War - the New Gods' game-ender is perhaps the best defensive 8-drop in the game - a go-home ability plus near-unlimited plot twist countering.
KEY CARDS - PLOT TWISTS
Astro-Force - discarding a New Gods card as an additional cost is kind of steep to say the least, but what you get - typically anywhere from +3/+3 to +6/+6 while attacking - more than makes up for it. Astro-Force is one of the most effective attack-up-the-curve cards in the game.
The Exchange - the tutor for both New Gods and Darkseid's Elite is extremely playable - although it requires you to discard equal or greater cost's worth of characters to fetch your New Gods or Elite character, it should be noted that you can discard ANY characters rather than just New Gods characters to do it - making it extremely well-suited for New Gods teamup decks.
Royal Decree - a universal team-up plot twist for the New Gods that provides all the card draw that popular twists like Common Enemy do.
KEY CARDS - LOCATIONS
The Source - immediately identified as the money card of the set, The Source can just wreck so many decks. Removing all copies of a given plot twist from a deck can hose so many decks it's not funny - a Sentinel deck without Reconstruction Program? A Gotham deck without Fizzle? A New Brotherhood deck without TNB? No wonder this card is so highly valued.
New Genesis - a recovery location that regenerates Cosmic counters is a big deal for the Cosmic-dependent New Gods. But two character cards? Ouch! Means you won't be using it in a hurry, to say the least.
KEY CARDS - EQUIPMENT
Supercycle - it's groovy, baby! A Fantasticar, except uncommon, and it gives invulnerability to the character holding it if they have a Cosmic counter! Groovy!
DO THEY WIN, AND WHY?
Generally speaking, not yet. With the exception of Team Superman, the Man of Steel teams have yet to pierce the metagame.
WHY DO THEY LOSE?
When a team has as many big plusses as the New Gods do, you start to wonder. The team has flaws, obviously, but before we even start mentioning their weaknesses, it's worth remembering that the New Gods showed up just as everybody and their grandmother found out that Curve Sentinels was a vicious top-tier deck that was both extremely effective and ridiculously easy to play - and when a deck like that shows up, it discourages people from trying out new decks at tournaments.
But we can't put all the blame on Curve Sentinels. A lot of the problem is that the New Gods are overly dependent on Cosmic counters for their main strengths. You literally can't build a New Gods deck without having one or two characters with Cosmic, and unlike Team Superman, New Gods characters without Cosmic tend to be pretty blah or even actively below average.
The other problem is that of card draw. As in, the New Gods really don't have any. This is problematic because the best New Gods tricks tend to have tons of discard costs - Astro Force, New Genesis, Izaya, et cetera - and they have no way to fuel that engine, much in the same way that Sinister Syndicate doesn't.
Of course, there is an obvious answer to that: use Royal Decree (which is excellent) and team up with a faction that does have card draw. The problem here is that people are naturally a bit reluctant to play teamup decks because of their innate fragility.
In any case, the New Gods have most of a toolkit ready for use. It just hasn't been adequately explored yet.
CONCLUSION
If you're looking for a challenging team with a lot of potential that hasn't been fully tapped yet, the New Gods are your ticket to excitement. Just remember to deal with their draw and Cosmic issues and you'll be set.
One peice of advise when running Team Super-man, run 4 mother box and Cir-el. should you have both ready for turn six and some counters on your Super-men you can gain a lot of extra endurance.
not much has changed with doom, latverian embassy and purple man just enhaces his plot twist control. diplomatic immunity keeps doom safe while he uses his tricks.
but at his core, doom is the same, not like sentinels, they have changed drastically since origins.
Hello everyone -- I'd just like to say how overwhelming the positive response to this thread has been, and my elation at your enthusiasm is matched only by my regret at not having been able to update it regularly.
This is mostly due to the fact that I'm being kept extremely busy by my slave masters at the law firm where I'm presently employed. I started working on this thread before my employment began, and now that it's in full swing, I'm usually either too occupied or too exhausted to continue, for the most part.
Many thanks to chdb for updating the thread, and bringing his own astute observations to the fore while maintaining the old format.
Well. I think I've rambled on long enough.
I'm going to jump ahead a bit here, considering that I may be pre-empting thread posts that chdb could be working on as I write.
You'll have to forgive me if I end up posting in installments - I really don't have as much time to spare as I used to.
M A R V E L K N I G H T S
The signature team of the latest Marvel VS expansion, this unlikely cast of grim and gritty heroes draws its members from various titles of Marvel's "noir" line. With some notable exceptions, this team sets fancy powers aside for some good old-fashioned butt-kicking.
STRENGTHS
Brute Attack Strength - the MK attack step strikes fear into the hearts of opponents like Ghost Rider's creepy penance stare. Sporting above-average ATK values and a whole slew of team-specific plot twists that can pump that ATK to pant-wetting levels, this team can punch through all but the toughest of defenses, and cause monstrous breakthrough endurance loss while they're at it.
KO Tech - MK snicker when they see a Finishing Move. They have so many ways of removing stunned characters from the field, and derive decent benefits from wiping the streets clean of filth, as well. This, of course, translates into board control not seen since the likes of the Teen Titans.
Equipment Exploitation - between team-specific equipment and the general hardware that's already out there, the MK know how to prepare for a fight. Punisher's incarnations lead the charge, and overall, equipment is not for them the wasted investment it is for most other teams.
Expanded Team Tech - The MK have access to many of the tricks of the other teams, and Midnight Sons is the incredible card that makes it all possible. A Teen Titans deck without any Titans? An FF Beats deck without FF? A Doom deck without Doom? Well, maybe not the last one, but MK is perhaps the most flexible team in the game.
Character Search - Wild Ride is an excellent search card to make sure you hit your optimal drops, and Dagger helps you fetch Midnight Sons to open up the MK tech buffet. Few other teams have the potential to set up so easily.
WEAKNESSES
Endurance Loss - Quite a number of the MK effects require the payment of endurance, and anyone who's used Tempest in TT too many times knows that a little can add up to a lot in a short time. Later in the game, the MK can get paralyzed into inaction either because they can't afford to pay the increasingly steep costs involved.
Initiative Dependence - Far too many of the nifty MK effects can only be utilized on the attack or when you control the initiative. This means that the MK game will generally be lopsided as you suffer at the whim of your opponent every other turn, hoping to make back the deficit next turn.
Zero Defensive Tech - There's very little the MK player can do when on the receiving end of things. You just have to hope that you hit harder and faster than the other team.
PLAY STYLE
There's not much finesse to playing the MK, with their potent attack tricks and methods for launching their ATK values into the stratosphere. Any chance you can get to cut a huge swath through your opponent's endurance, you might as well take it. The prevalence of hidden characters among the ranks of the MK will allow you to take advantage of their ATK tactics even when you don't have the initiative - unfortunately, however, you'll have to soak up the extra direct endurance loss you'll probably suffer from being unable to absorb the enemy attack.
The huge ATK values the MK can muster mean you'll most probably be able to stun something every turn, so use those KO abilities when you can to control the board and keep the enemy count low. The less characters the opponents have, the less you have to worry about your hidden characters being unable to successfully defend.
D A R K S E I D ' S E L I T E
The baddest mofo in the DC Universe is Darkseid. Hence, he has a team. Nuff said. (Except that, according to Jack Kirby, his name is pronounced Dark-SIDE, not Dark-SEED. Common mistake.)
STRENGTHS
Endurance Loss - no team has quite so many ways to burn you badly as the Elite do. Desaad, Anti-Life Equation, Bernadeth, Devilance, Gole, Topkick, Glorious Godfrey... I could go on...
KO Tech - the Elite possess a number of ways to clear the field, like Darkseid - Uxas and Omega Beams. "Wiping the board clean" strategically usually ends up equalling advantage for the big bad 'Seid and his crew.
Weenie Tech - Darkseid's Elite are naturally suited to making the most of smaller-drop characters - splashing them in and then making them Elite with Granny Goodness, boosting their size with Armagetto, pumping a horde with Hordes of Apokolips - the Elite excel at having a spud take out a heavyweight. Assuming you don't care if they live or die, anyway, but then again, that's how Darkseid thinks...
Face-Down Resource Tech - Darkseid decks punish opponents for keeping resources face-down. Since most players like to conserve their resource row as much as possible (as this is generally a wise play tactic), Darkseid forces your opponent to choose between either using or revealing key tricks early, or taking a beating.
WEAKNESSES
Mutually Assured Destruction - most of Darkseid's burn tools work both ways. Granny Loves You causes burn to everybody. Gole only does damage when he gets stunned. Hunger Dogs give everybody a tick of damage. It's often very difficult to get Darkseid decks to do more damage to their opponent than to themselves.
Lack of Drops - with a mere 20 characters, Darkseid decks are often starved for choices when it comes to drops. Early game, you can play a lot of Deep Six or... not. This makes Darkseid decks extremely predictable - even a straightforward Fantastic Four deck has options at most drops, but Darkseid decks will generally have to be very straightforward in what they drop.
PLAY STYLE
Although no tier one Darkseid deck has emerged as of yet, two major decktypes have emerged.
The first is a weenie swarm deck, using the Deep Six, Granny Goodness and Desaad (and a few larger key drops like Devilance and Uxas) to take control of the field early and cause a lot of damage fast. The second is a more traditonal curve/control deck, using Darkseid's KO tech and control abilities to keep the board as favorable towards yourself as possible. Both decks have proven successful on occasion but in need of further tuning to really impact the metagame.
KEY CARDS - CHARACTER
Desaad, Royal Torturer - a cheap weenie who can cause serious damage is the sort of character that makes a Darkseid deck hum. And he's really easy to splash into other decks, if you were so inclined.
Trok, Deep Six - A 6/6 is nothing special, but depending on how many resources are showing on turn 4, Trok can usually be anywhere from a 7 to a 10 ATK, which is certainly nothing to sneeze at.
Devilance, The Pursuer - Darkseid's 5-drop of choice, Devilance is a vicious 9/8 who causes additional damage in addition to a stun, which is really all I should have to say about why you want to play him, except to add that he can also boost to be a reasonable replacement on turn 7.
Darkseid, Uxas - A beatstick 6-drop who can KO the entire stunned board with a single action? Hell yes.
Superman, False Son - KO tech gone EXTREME in a 16/14 badass with flight and range. Nothing like automatic board clearing, which is why False Son has started to show up as an alternative to Magneto in decks needing a 7-drop.
Darkseid, Lord of Apokolips - might as well read "survive turn 8 and win the game."
OTHER CHARACTERS OF NOTE
Kurin, Deep Six - Reusable attack pump = solid. If Kurin shows up on turn 1, you can expect a 5-10 point extra swing in Endurance from his ability alone.
Jaffar, Deep Six - Jaffar is good for one thing and one thing only - forcing out a massive Trok on turn 3 rather than turn 4. But let's face it - that's one heck of a good thing.
Granny Goodness, Everybody's Favorite Granny - key for any weenie swarm strategy, Granny both pumps your other characters AND lets you splash in characters from other teams and turn them into Elitists. Do you like the idea of recruiting Rhino, Elektra, Kingpin or Logan to the Elite? Then Granny's your ticket.
Bernadeth, Leader of Female Furies - cause damage for recovering characters? That's a nasty little ability! The problem is that Bernadeth has to survive to the recovery phase most times for her ability to really kick in - but even so, she's an 8/6, which isn't half bad.
Kanto, Assassin - the ultimate in punishing players for not revealing resources, Kanto, for a measly payment of 3 endurance, KOs your opponent's smaller characters. Plus, he's a solid 12/11 with range.
KEY CARDS - PLOT TWISTS
Omega Beams - CLEAR THE ROAD! Because that's what this does - sweeps the board clean of everybody stunned in one fell swoop. Hard to use, but devastating.
The Exchange - Darkseid's tutor is the same as the New Gods' and just as effective (often moreso given that Darkseid weenie decks tend to make it easier to tutor with The Exchange).
Hordes of Apokolips - a less restricted version of Spider Slayers or Combat Protocols, and those were both solid cards to begin with. Key to any weenie Darkseid deck.
KEY CARDS - LOCATIONS
Apokolips - the big daddy of combat pumps for the Elite, Apokolips punishes your opponent for not revealing cards - or, alternately, rewards you for not revealing them. This is what we call a "win-win" sort of a card.
Armagetto - KO an Elite character to pump one of your guys for +3/+3; sure, it might sound like a bad deal on paper, but considering you can KO your own stunned characters (including in response to cards like Finishing Move), it quickly becomes a better deal real fast.
KEY CARDS - EQUIPMENT
Beta Club is the only piece of Elite-specific Equipment, but DAMN is it solid - turning any Elite attacker into Batman, Caped Crusader for free is an excellent, excellent deal that will cause much pain to your foes.
DO THEY WIN, AND WHY?
No. They're close - Darkseid decks have started popping up in the finals of PCQs - but no Elite deck has particularly impressed at this point.
WHY DO THEY LOSE?
Darkseid's Elite is a very, very difficult faction to play. Partially this is because some of their best mechanics are counterintuitive to how VS has played from the start ("sacrificing one of my own guys for pump? WTF?"); partially this is because their control tech tends to be all-or-nothing (Uxas, Omega Beams) and it's hard to time that, and partially it's because they have low DEF and no defensive tech to compensate.
But people are continuing to build solid decks out of the Elite, and with the tech going the way it is, many people think it's only a matter of time before an Elite deck really starts making waves.
CONCLUSION
Darkseid's Elite is vicious and punishing - both against an opponent and against a player using the deck who makes a key mistake. If you want a mental workout, but also an effective deck, Darkseid may just be your ticket to fun.
KEY CARDS - EQUIPMENT
Entropy Aegis Armor is pretty bad. Trust me on this.
[/b]
I've usually found it a useful card to have in hand to upgrade a lower character in case of a missed dropped. It should almost always stay in your hand if you can play another character, but upgrading your biggest character +3/+3 has helped me pull some wins out of bad situations.
Also, sometimes I'd rather have another copy of Clark Kent with the armor on the 5th Turn than Cir-El; he'll have 1 higher defense, and I love the ability.
Um, I fit wasn't too much trouble, might we update the older teams so that people don't get utterly confused? If it was too much trouble, then forget I said anything.