Hey all. I haven't been here much, since I literally have not played a single game of Heroclix even since summer. I refuse to have any unnecessary gatherings, as that is unnecessary risk. Also, people just haven't wanted to play with me online, so whatever, been off all this time. Now the rules are changing, which will definitely affect me when/if I get to sit at a table with this again. I was going to make a whole separate post, but it looks like multiple others have done that already, and I don't want to spam it up. So, just on this issue, disregarding article 2:

I'm all in on this. Pushing damage has always been a (ugh, sorry) [i]pushy[/u] subject when I introduce the game to new players. I've had one go so far as to say they're just not willing to play it with this as a mechanic. We've seen a rather abundant amount of Indomitable going around lately, and "lately" for me being basically the entirety of the time I've been back in the game since TMNT. Most anyone that you'd want to be a threat has it, and if it doesn't, they're much less likely to get played. This is one of the things that's held back my Spider-Island Iron Fist and TMNT4 Alopex, because the lack of Willpower holds them back *so much!* The mechanic is supposed to represent overexertion, but rarely does that ever really come across in gameplay. Hell, Jon Stewart is kind of a running gag at this point for being a Green Lantern that so rarely gets Willpower. It just doesn't come up thematically. The *more* important issue on pushing a character is that they won't be able to act at all on the next turn.
Side benefit: I no longer have to tell people that their vehicle is overexerting itself by pushing.

One thing that seems to confuse people since I heard about this is Colossal Stamina. Honestly, I don't know why you're all confused about it. They're retiring the mechanic. Ok... but it still exists. They're just not making it *again.* The symbols that gave it, those being Masters of Evil and the colossal fist, simply don't give it out anymore. They give out different abilities. The characters that specifically have Colossal Stamina would still have it. We went through this when symbols got streamlined in 2017. Losing Merge and Sharpshooter didn't remove them from the game. They were just Golden Age rules.
Of course, Power Cosmic and related TA's just got nuts, now. Starfire and Grandmaster will probably get played more now that I am more likely to let them keep going every turn. Poor Wyrm... they gave him Indomitable and PROTECTED: Outwit so that he could effectively be a god, but he just got left behind.

Honestly, big figs are actually *less* likely to keep going now that they're not always guaranteed the ability to keep acting. You could roll 1-2 on both relevant turns, and now you're stuck with a colossal piece that can't move. This is still kind of thematic, as you usually think of something that size as being a kind of slow titan, though the high chance of removing action tokens will generally make them *feel* like they're constantly going. Again, those times when they are not allowed to act because you rolled low, you're going to really wish for the old way. However, this will also breathe life into the "merely" giant pieces. They'll be on more of a rampage than before. As usual, every rule change brings some benefits and some losses.

I also feel like this will make Willpower significantly more worth consideration to put on standard-size characters. Now that Willpower is self-Leadership, you would probably want it more than Toughness. Maybe you'd want Invulnerability more. I can imagine some of the more berserker characters like Wolverine getting Willpower on top so that they can just keep bringing the hurt.

Overall, yeah I don't mind this at all. I wish they could've come up with something better for Masters of Evil, but otherwise it's all fine.

I have a binder of house rules to make this game more offense and less defense. It never once occurred to me to remove pushing damage. It's a key strategic element core to clix. Now you move every turn and matches will be decided by who rolls willpower most often.

They have to have Willpower for that to happen. Not everyone has PAC Willpower, everyone just no longer takes pushing damage.

I do not play in any events, just with some friends and family and I have to say the complexity had become completely out of hand. Trying to explain to new or people that didn't play much is crazy. I just opened a booster of recent fantastic four release and reading the card made me roll my eyes. I like some nuance to give the individual pieces some character but it is no longer fun.
I am 100% in for simplifying this game, I want new people to join and buy so I can keep adding to my plastic crack addiction. That being said I hope the changes are good for the long run and I will wait to see all the rules before making any judgements. Even then, I will want to play a few times to see how they really play out. Fingers crossed.

Very well said.

I'm doing the same.

And by the way, most of the players that are saying they accept the changes are lying. They know it sucks but they'll just comply to keep playing. Good for them, but in the end it won't amount to much because the game is finished and it's just a matter of time before the collapse. Do you really believe this will explode sales? If they stepped back and analyzed everything, they would see it.

Like you said above. I've got enough stuff to last me indefinitely. I don't need anything new.

I would have preferred to keep Indomitable to use Willpower (as it was intended) and if you want to minimize the amount of times a person has to roll, then make it like Leadership ('For all figures with this power, roll a die, on a result of 5-6 remove an action token from each). Worrying about the amount of times a person rolls a die for Indomitable is no different than rolling for a team full of Willpower.

As I wrote on another thread: If the goal was to allow figures to act two turns in a row without self-damage, the change should have been:

1) Remove the penalty for taking self-damage when a figure gets a second token.

2) Add/keep the disallowing of taking a costed action/accept an action token beyond the second token.

3) Keep the effect of Incapacitate the same. (It gives action tokens or unavoidable damage in limited circumstances)

4) Keep/Modify the dispensation for certain characters (i.e. Masters of Evil) to break (2) above, but at the cost of a click of unavoidable damage.

What I wrote above is pretty much only changing one rule (1), but it is preserving several key game effects. All of that could have been implemented independent of changes to Willpower and .

If they want to toss all benefits previously enjoyed by Willpower and/or , it doesn't matter. If they want to give new benefits to one or both of those, it doesn't matter. I would have preferred they left this part of the game alone... but the actual change they decided to make started a serious avalanche that is wholly unnecessary.

I completely agree with your above statement. In fact, if they wanted to limit the amount of dice rolled and simplify rules, they could have made Willpower work like Colossal Stamina. In fact, it would even be thematic. Pushing yourself past the 2 costed actions limit, but at a price.

I am curious if you still feel this is true now that we have see the new PAC and introduction rule book?

Dear Wizkids, If you want to draw in new players, at this point, your best bet is to just start over, go back to the basics. This game has so much baggage attached to it that every time you tweak it, you tend to lose as many players as you gain, if not more.

As I've said elsewhere, I think they really do want a new game, but they also want the established player base they already have.

If the new game is good, new players will come and old players will return.

But, if they keep mucking with the current game, they are going to lose what little goodwill remains from that dwindling player base.