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Actually, if you read the last Official Handbook entry for the Avengers, it mentions the JLA/Avengers cross-over as happening. The entry sidesteps mentioning names, referring to them as heroes from another universe, but it's clear that's what they are talking about.
Also of note is that in the JLA book, things about Krona involving the JLA/Avengers crossover are/were referred to in the JLA comics.
How did I contradict myself? I stated that Robots can apparently use it because they have no soul to be judge upon.
But you said the robot Air-Walker had a soul then said that robots don't have souls.
Quote : Originally Posted by oracle2099
Air-Walker (animated by the soul of Nova Corps captain Gabriel Lan) has used it. Robots apparently can due to the fact that they have no soul and thus there is nothing to judge.
But you said the robot Air-Walker had a soul then said that robots don't have souls.
Air Walker is a robot in a similar way that Rom or Cliff Steele are robots.
I want these clixed: Doc Savage, Fu Manchu, Tarzan, The Shadow, The Green Hornet & Kato, Conan, Solomon Kane, The Phantom, King Kong, Universal Monsters, Black Orchid, Manhunter (Paul Kirk), Xemnu the Titan, unclixed Kirby Fourth World characters, and Lilith, Daughter Of Dracula.
Air Walker is a robot in a similar way that Rom or Cliff Steele are robots.
That doesn't mean they have souls or not.
Take the Vision. He's synthetic, but could be considered a living thing. He may have a soul, but then again, it wouldn't preclude him from the ability of lifting the hammer of Thor.
That doesn't mean they have souls or not.
Take the Vision. He's synthetic, but could be considered a living thing. He may have a soul, but then again, it wouldn't preclude him from the ability of lifting the hammer of Thor.
They would have souls. In each case their essence was placed inside robot bodies. The Vision would be different since he was patterned after Simon Williams but wasn't really Simon Williams, unless you want to take a page from Piers Anthony and say that the Vision inherited a piece of Simon's soul which eventually grew into a complete soul of it's own. An idea that's not unreasonable given how much heart he demonstrated before they decided to ruin him as a character.
Never the less anybody who is deemed worthy of lifting Thor's hammer needs to have a bit of the paladin in their aspect. Which is why Superman and Cap are prime candidates, (and probably Jay Garrick and Barry Allen.)
I want these clixed: Doc Savage, Fu Manchu, Tarzan, The Shadow, The Green Hornet & Kato, Conan, Solomon Kane, The Phantom, King Kong, Universal Monsters, Black Orchid, Manhunter (Paul Kirk), Xemnu the Titan, unclixed Kirby Fourth World characters, and Lilith, Daughter Of Dracula.
I picked it up at the comic book shop last week. Then I saw that it was $40.00 for a plastic hammer, figured it wouldn't serve me any good against Rock Trolls, and put it back. The thunder that came down from the sky as I wielded it was a bit unnerving, I might add.
1/6th of the Brothers Prob. '19-'20 Season: 15-13(8 events) 2 wins, 2nd XDPS PR 9-7, 7th SOC
They would have souls. In each case their essence was placed inside robot bodies. The Vision would be different since he was patterned after Simon Williams but wasn't really Simon Williams, unless you want to take a page from Piers Anthony and say that the Vision inherited a piece of Simon's soul which eventually grew into a complete soul of it's own. An idea that's not unreasonable given how much heart he demonstrated before they decided to ruin him as a character.
Never the less anybody who is deemed worthy of lifting Thor's hammer needs to have a bit of the paladin in their aspect. Which is why Superman and Cap are prime candidates, (and probably Jay Garrick and Barry Allen.)
But Supes only picked up the hammer when Thor temporarily removed the enchantments.
As for the Vision, he's also got brainwaves from some professor (the name eludes me at the moment) after he'd been dismantled by John Byrne.
As for the bots having souls or not, who knows? That's like the question about weither or not clones have souls.
I picked it up at the comic book shop last week. Then I saw that it was $40.00 for a plastic hammer, figured it wouldn't serve me any good against Rock Trolls, and put it back. The thunder that came down from the sky as I wielded it was a bit unnerving, I might add.
As long as you didn't clock someone upside the head with it in the store, it's all good.
I'd feel real sorry for your half-brother if he happened to be standing next to you at the time.
But Supes only picked up the hammer when Thor temporarily removed the enchantments.
As for the Vision, he's also got brainwaves from some professor (the name eludes me at the moment) after he'd been dismantled by John Byrne.
As for the bots having souls or not, who knows? That's like the question about weither or not clones have souls.
Well, that's where the writer dropped the ball. If a character like Beta Ray Bill would be worthy of lifting the hammer Superman would certainly be worthy.
As for the Vision that John Byrne story was the beginning of the end for decent Vision stories. As for robots it is up to your interpretation whether they have souls but Air Walker, Rom (and the other SpaceKnights) and Robot Man are a different story. Cliff Steele's brain is encased in a robot's body. And the other characters all had their complete life essence transferred to robot bodies. In the Space Knight's case their bodies were preserved to be returned to once the war against the Dire Wraiths was over.
I want these clixed: Doc Savage, Fu Manchu, Tarzan, The Shadow, The Green Hornet & Kato, Conan, Solomon Kane, The Phantom, King Kong, Universal Monsters, Black Orchid, Manhunter (Paul Kirk), Xemnu the Titan, unclixed Kirby Fourth World characters, and Lilith, Daughter Of Dracula.
I would just like to point out that, among the science fiction community, there is a distintc difference between robots, androids, and cyborgs.
Robots are automatons (i.e. "soulless"), androids are synthetic life-forms, and cyborgs are organic life-forms with cybernetic enhancements/replacements (these latter two are conventionally held to possess souls).
However, all are classified as "Robots" for the purpose of Heroclix Keywords when in fact they are all very different things.
A Doombot is a robot in both actuality and keyword, while Air-Walker is an android in actuality and possesses the "Robot" keyword, and Beta Ray Bill is a cyborg in actuality and also possesses the "Robot" keyword.
Anyhow, hope this helps with the theroretical theological discussion at hand.
Quote : Originally Posted by wintremute
I really, really, really wish there was a real-life situation where I could tell a large group of people, "YOU ARE NO LONGER ALLOWED TO SPEAK THE WORDS TO LIONEL RICHIE'S SONG, HELLO, AS YOU ARE INTIMIDATING PEOPLE."
Well, that's where the writer dropped the ball. If a character like Beta Ray Bill would be worthy of lifting the hammer Superman would certainly be worthy.
As for the Vision that John Byrne story was the beginning of the end for decent Vision stories. As for robots it is up to your interpretation whether they have souls but Air Walker, Rom (and the other SpaceKnights) and Robot Man are a different story. Cliff Steele's brain is encased in a robot's body. And the other characters all had their complete life essence transferred to robot bodies. In the Space Knight's case their bodies were preserved to be returned to once the war against the Dire Wraiths was over.
I can do agree with you about the Byrne Vision. The only thing I liked that Byrne did with the Vision was the discovery that he was NOT the original Human Torch reworked by Ultron. Tho, that was retcon'd later. I still think it should have been "discovered" that he was actually Adam 2, but that's just my opinion on the subject.
I always thought of the Space Knights as being more or less cyborgs.
Air-Walker no longer has the android body, if I recall, he's now the main computer program for Galactus' World Ship. If he has a soul still, it'd be an interesting mix.
And I'm not sure Superman would be worthy. He has killed before when he was on that parallel earth and killed Zod and his cohorts (come to think of it, I think that was a Bryne storyline as well).
I can do agree with you about the Byrne Vision. The only thing I liked that Byrne did with the Vision was the discovery that he was NOT the original Human Torch reworked by Ultron. Tho, that was retcon'd later. I still think it should have been "discovered" that he was actually Adam 2, but that's just my opinion on the subject.
I always thought of the Space Knights as being more or less cyborgs.
Air-Walker no longer has the android body, if I recall, he's now the main computer program for Galactus' World Ship. If he has a soul still, it'd be an interesting mix.
And I'm not sure Superman would be worthy. He has killed before when he was on that parallel earth and killed Zod and his cohorts (come to think of it, I think that was a Bryne storyline as well).
But Superman did that as an absolute last resort, knowing that one Kryptonian was no match for three. he knew there was no other options and vowed he'd never do it again.
Besides Thor has killed often in Asgardian wars as has Cap in WWII. Killing doesn't preclude worthiness as much as how you kill does. Sociopathic characters like Red Hulk and Superboy Prime could never qualify, but if the killings were in self defense or to protect helpless people, that wouldn't be a problem.
I want these clixed: Doc Savage, Fu Manchu, Tarzan, The Shadow, The Green Hornet & Kato, Conan, Solomon Kane, The Phantom, King Kong, Universal Monsters, Black Orchid, Manhunter (Paul Kirk), Xemnu the Titan, unclixed Kirby Fourth World characters, and Lilith, Daughter Of Dracula.