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I find it funny that now that a team/ruling comes out that would make the game no fun for the competitive player, people are whining about not wanting to be the competitive player to face it so the person playing it should be banned.
Dice rolls will be the bane of my competitive Heroclix career.
But you just said to call out the other player in your previous post.
What if they are fans of the GLA and Grasshopper and Sandman is their favorite Spidey villain?
Either determine that this particular team can't be played prior to the event, or don't get butthurt if you face it. Not directed specifically at you, but I see ROC members in here saying how they'd DQ someone for playing this team which is just a bully tactic, IMO. Angry for anger's sake.
Exactly my point... whether it's a player's favorite figures or whether they are trying to "break the tournament" is a hard call, but that's what the judge is there for. If the player bringing this team has a look of evil glee in his eye, that could be an easy sign, but if they seem to not understand why it would be a problem, the judge may have to allow them to play (perhaps warning them not to remove all of their figures from the map if they truly want to play them).
I'm not saying this particular team is inherently evil, just like a team base isn't automatically going to win (especially if a player just likes the characters and doesn't use the team base to its full potential).
I have one player that thinks up potentially overpowered combinations and some of them have really pushed it, but I haven't banned him from an event (yet) because he also doesn't like to have no challenge in a game and will get rid of any team that is too easily abusive... he's also the type that would play a 600 point team base and only use 1 action per turn because he likes the characters.
-Heroclix is not a game of logic, it's a game of strategy .... after all, when's the last time that you saw a giant (using a stealth ability) that was hiding behind a swingset... and nobody could SEE him????
I don't care about the implications that this rule has for home games, or standard tournament play, or anything like that. However, for big WizKids events it does create an interesting situation. If I think my odds of winning nationals are less than 12.5%, it might be my best option to try and win three games via roll off. Maybe the rule should be changed, maybe it shouldn't, I don't have a particular opinion either way. However, I am really opposed to people getting DQ'ed for something that is clearly not against the rules.
But even at a worlds event if you run that team and sit across someone that has a real shot at winning the grinder and you just cripple him to "teach him/wk/whoever a lesson", you are ruining that player's experience just as much as anyone else would be ruining your fun event.
{I can't believe this exploded by 3 pages since I left 12 hours ago. thank you I don't have to read page 5 & 6 yet}
THIS!!!!
If 4 guys, that had it out for say Patrick (or Ben Chung, or insert previous winner here), all fielded this team and only pulled off the tactic if they faced Patrick (or his friends from last year) and then didn't (but rather let an opponent get points) against the other 2-3 opponents in the qualifying rounds, then that's a real jerk move. Like playing a LAMP team against 10yo kids on "bring your kid to clix day". If you can't stand the current META (or children...)
Don't. Play. In. The. Event.
EDIT: Now to read page 5 and 6... and apparently 7
Simple solution, new rule: "A power that removes a friendly character from the board cannot be taken if it would result in there being no friendly characters on the board at the end of the turn."
Simple solution, new rule: "A power that removes a friendly character from the board cannot be taken if it would result in there being no friendly characters on the board at the end of the turn."
Except wizkids has specifically condoned this tactic
Dice rolls will be the bane of my competitive Heroclix career.
If this becomes a thing, the meta will simply change to "always win map roll and make sure you can Outwit something in the opposing starting area on turn 1".
Yoda of Borg, we are: Futile, resistance is. Assimilate you, we will.
The build is legal, even condoned by wizkids themselves as per their post in the ruling link.
Look at the character itself (Grasshopper.) Its even plausible that Wizkids designed the figure with just such an outcome in mind.
Would it be a dick move to play this "team?" Maybe. But no less a dick move than bringing $300 worth of entities and other meta-bending clix: the player is still using the printed abilities of legal characters to win a tournament based on the given rules.
Okay, so, Meta-Man just built a meta team for mega bucks and decided to trek halfway across the nation to play this uber-team and wipe up the floor with the competition. Meta-Man doesn't care if the other guy has fun, he just wants to win! Regardless of the fact that the other guy ALSO drove/flew halfway across the country to get there.
How is that any different than Grasshopper-Man not giving a damn about whether or Meta-Man has any fun or how far he had to drive? Grasshopper-Man also wants to win and based on the rules, this is his best shot at winning.
So, Grasshopper-Man vs. Meta-Man - both drove halfway across the globe to get there, both have hundreds of dollars on the line, both want to win. Why is one inherently better or more valid than the other? Why should one be banned but not the other?
Me? I'm neither Grasshopper-Man nor Meta-Man...but I'd dearly love to watch this one played out! I just hope there's popcorn.
May all your hits be crits!
On the whole, human beings want to be good — but not too good, and not quite all the time. - George Orwell
If this becomes a thing, the meta will simply change to "always win map roll and make sure you can Outwit something in the opposing starting area on turn 1".
Apart from the fact that you can't target a character on turn 1 because of First Turn Immunity.
It won't become a thing simply because of human nature. You have been able to do this for a while now and I haven't heard of anyone who decided to spend all their money to attend a major event just to annoy some random strangers they get drawn against. The exploit exists but no one is stupid enough to actually follow through and do it.
Edit1: Of course I think it would be hilarious if someone actually did do it.
Edit2: Although not against me
The biggest selection of heroclix in the UK www.blueratgames.com
[SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
If this becomes a thing, the meta will simply change to "always win map roll and make sure you can Outwit something in the opposing starting area on turn 1".
Except one problem there. First turn immunity..... ninja'd by bluerat
Dice rolls will be the bane of my competitive Heroclix career.
Okay, so, Meta-Man just built a meta team for mega bucks and decided to trek halfway across the nation to play this uber-team and wipe up the floor with the competition. Meta-Man doesn't care if the other guy has fun, he just wants to win! Regardless of the fact that the other guy ALSO drove/flew halfway across the country to get there.
How is that any different than Grasshopper-Man not giving a damn about whether or Meta-Man has any fun or how far he had to drive? Grasshopper-Man also wants to win and based on the rules, this is his best shot at winning.
So, Grasshopper-Man vs. Meta-Man - both drove halfway across the globe to get there, both have hundreds of dollars on the line, both want to win. Why is one inherently better or more valid than the other? Why should one be banned but not the other?
Me? I'm neither Grasshopper-Man nor Meta-Man...but I'd dearly love to watch this one played out! I just hope there's popcorn.
THEY MIGHT BE GIANTS - "Particle Man"
Particle man, particle man
Doing the things a particle can
What's he like? It's not important
Particle man
Is he a dot, or is he a speck?
When he's underwater does he get wet?
Or does the water get him instead?
Nobody knows, Particle man
Triangle man, Triangle man
Triangle man hates particle man
They have a fight, Triangle wins
Triangle man
Universe man, Universe man
Size of the entire universe man
Usually kind to smaller man
Universe man
He's got a watch with a minute hand,
Millenium hand and an eon hand
When they meet it's a happy land
Powerful man, universe man
Person man, person man
Hit on the head with a frying pan
Lives his life in a garbage can
Person man
Is he depressed or is he a mess?
Does he feel totally worthless?
Who came up with person man?
Degraded man, person man
Triangle man, triangle man
Triangle man hates person man
They have a fight, triangle wins
Triangle man
Even better if you can find the Dragon Ball Z Anime Contest Music Video from 15 years ago... "Hilarious."
Particle man, particle man
Doing the things a particle can
What's he like? It's not important
Particle man
Is he a dot, or is he a speck?
When he's underwater does he get wet?
Or does the water get him instead?
Nobody knows, Particle man
Triangle man, Triangle man
Triangle man hates particle man
They have a fight, Triangle wins
Triangle man
Universe man, Universe man
Size of the entire universe man
Usually kind to smaller man
Universe man
He's got a watch with a minute hand,
Millenium hand and an eon hand
When they meet it's a happy land
Powerful man, universe man
Person man, person man
Hit on the head with a frying pan
Lives his life in a garbage can
Person man
Is he depressed or is he a mess?
Does he feel totally worthless?
Who came up with person man?
Degraded man, person man
Triangle man, triangle man
Triangle man hates person man
They have a fight, triangle wins
Triangle man
Even better if you can find the Dragon Ball Z Anime Contest Music Video from 15 years ago... "Hilarious."
My entry for next year's t-shirt contest will be "Grasshopper-Man vs. Meta-Man." One guy with nothing but a grasshopper on the map against a meta-player with a map/sideboard lined with figures, relics, resources, etc.... The caption: "Roll-Off Pending"
May all your hits be crits!
On the whole, human beings want to be good — but not too good, and not quite all the time. - George Orwell
My entry for next year's t-shirt contest will be "Grasshopper-Man vs. Meta-Man." One guy with nothing but a grasshopper on the map against a meta-player with a map/sideboard lined with figures, relics, resources, etc.... The caption: "Roll-Off Pending"