... and expansions every 3 months. Don't think you have to worry about that.

I understand that. The sig is in response to the people who think they have to quit if they quit buying.

I plan to be around as long as WK supports the game.

And yes, I thought about the sealed events (which I will play in) and the effect it will have on my must buy date.

Also, if you can simplify your post to fit in a sig block, I will use it. It fits what I was trying to say in my sig block, but could not make it fit.

I agree with you that sales doesn't necessarily equate with fun or being better.

I was merely responding to jgklaws statement. He made an assumption on a game that he has never played. He stated that he only watched.

You cannot make a fair assessment of any game by just watching. You have to play it at least once to have some understanding of the game. Again this goes for any game.

I play both Mage Knight and the D&D minis game. I won't say that the D&D minis game is more fun that Mage Knight, but it is a very fun game to play.

I think with the D&D minis game if you were not into Dungeons and Dragons you may not like this game.

As far as my comments about it outselling Mage Knight that may have been an overstatement, but here is why I made it.

At the hobby stores that I frequent in St. Louis all of the stores are having problems ordering enough so they can keep regular stock levels. Whenever I want to buy any I have to have them keep some behind the counter so they don't sell them. They are not having this problem with Mage Knight.

I have also talked to a couple of store owners that I have met through conventions and while not exactly the same they have told me that they do sell the D&D minis much better than Mage Knight right now.

So while it may be an overstatement for some areas of the country it still has some backing to it. Also some of the PR releases from WOTC indicate that the sales mimic those of Mage Knight when Mage Knight was in its heyday.

hmm, I didn't just watch, I should clarify, I also talked to the players and learned a little about the game. Also, the guys were MK players also, so I could use their comparisons too...

anyway, if people like D&D, more power to them, it doesn't bother me :)

but I know lots of D&D players who have had huge problems with rules issues, WotC policies, and things that make WK seem golden by comparison - maybe those are just isolated incidents? I don't know enough about it to really say.

anyway, I'm through trying to convince anyone to stay and play and support MK, I'm reduced to just hoping now, I think I don't have any positions I haven't stated yet, and people are probably sick of me posting to try and get people to stick around :)

I just wish it were Wednesday so I could get a sneak peek of DR!!!

jgklaw,

I admire what you are doing. I am also trying to do the same. I have been and continue to try to get players in my area back into the game.

So far I have had some success, but largely it is the same small group that show up for tournaments.

I haven't made any negative comments towards Mage Knight and you won't see any from me.

Anything negative I have to say is directed at WizKids for their blunders as I see them as the one and only reason that the game is in the state it is.

Our job of keeping the game alive would be much easier if the company that produces the game would help us out a little and stop turning people away from the game.

Xan, I appreciate you trying to get players back into the game--we are all in this together, and want to see MK thrive.

As for sales of MK and D&D, this will vary from location to location and from store to store. I noticed in the store that I frequent, MK is selling but D&D does not appear to be. Out of curiosity I will ask the store owner about this. In any event, I really do not want to get into a discussion comparing sales of the two products, as this will go nowhere and will be based upon speculation.

That would only make it difficult to hit Phalanx... won't alter his Defend SA.

How big can a sig be?

1 sealed every 2 months + 4 Marqees + 2 National Qualifiers +2 special events =20 Sealed over a 2 year rotation
3 boosters per Sealed/1 Base Set + 3 Expansions = 15 boosters per Set
4 figures per booster x 15 boosters = 60 figures per set, or 180-240 figures always available to play

Play Sealed, Never Retire


There, the first part is the math all cut down, the second sums it up. Pick whichever works best. :D

Xanathon:

Maybe it hasn't occurred to you, but by constantly slamming the company you drive people away from the game. It's all well and good to talk about how great the game is, but when people hear the company producing it doesn't know what they are doing, they go and look for a game that is put out by a company with a good reputation. I am surprised you don't understand that.
It doesn't matter how good the product may be if everyone thinks the people producing it are going to screw up supporting it. And that is what you are telling them. Just look at some of your complaints. All about how the game used to get support but now it doesn't. If you pulled in so many people telling them that, how can you expect to pull in more when you now tell them the exact opposite over and over again?

Our job of getting more people in would be easier if the people trying to help us would help us out and stop turning people off of the company and their support program.

I believe Xan does understand that. I think what he is trying to point out is Wk does not seem to understand that. Look at other games and often it is not the game that players have an issue with but the company and its handling of its properties.

MTG: You do not hear people complaining that MTG is a bad game. The complaints come from the rotation and such. How often have we heard in the last week from former MTG players on why they left the game. It is often because of the rotation and the amount of money needed to keep up.

GW: The grandfather of the min games. It is not the rules or the working of the game people complain about. They complain about how GW handles product and their games.

MK: It is not the game people complain about it is the communication issue that is often the source of complaints.


It is very hard to separate the company from its product. One does not hear often about a very poor product but the company is very good. It is when the product is very good but the company has issues that problems come about. When all of this boils down to it, its about a perception of poor communication and understanding between a company and its consumers. In the court of public appeal it is not the truth that matters but the perception of the truth. Currently It appears that the player base and the company seem to have a different perception of what the truth of the matter is.

MTG got expensive after rotation.... my average decks cost me well over $100 to build.

Stormrider99: That does not surprise me at all. I woudl liek to know though did you buy packs, singles, local store, ebay, trade, all of the above? With the rotation coming in I am interested to see how people that played in other games with a rotation gathered their resources.

I would study the MTG encyclopedia or apprentice to test out how the decks would work.... and if I liked the idea, I would trade or go on eBay to accumulate the cards necessary to complete my decks. After the Legends expansion.... I seldom bought booster packs.

EDIT: Yikes... that just made me think.... if they could build a program similar to Apprentice for MK.... then the idea of Rotation would have been in vain.

Tiktak_Kat,

When I am on this site I will speak my mind as people have already made up their mind whether they will play Mage Knight or not.

When I am trying to attract new players in my area I don't talk about WizKids. I only talk about the game.

There in lies the difference. I won't hide my opinion of WizKids and on this site I will speak my mind. People who have just joined this site don't do so unless they are already playing. Also most people could care less about what my opinion of the company is as it doesn't affect them at all.

For instance say a person joins MKRealms from Memphis Tennessee. They play in tournaments at a venue there. Why are they going to care what someone from St. Louis Missouri has to say? For that matter why does anyone really care what I have to say about WizKids outside of WizKids themselves?

People are leaving because they are tired of WizKids, but not everyone is. There are plenty of people, like myself, that are tired of how WizKids keeps hurting the game, but we continue to play.

I also believe that people are fully able to make up their own mind on this issue. They can decide for themselves if they are going to play Mage Knight or if they are going to stop playing. I don't think what other people say really have any affect on this.

Xanathon:
I didn't tell you not to speak your mind. Or to pretend you like WizKids when you don't. But I am going to call you on your claims.
If you don't have the power to negatively influence one person somewhere else to quit, how can you presume to have the power to influence hundreds of people everywhere to keep playing or start playing? Either you have the power to influence people or you don't. It can't be the half that makes you look good but not that half that doesn't.
Further, if you really think people don't care what your opinion is, why are you bothering to share it with them? I find it hard to believe that anyone is posting here expecting that nobody will give two shakes of a dead rat what they have to say. We are all participating in order to exchange views and ideas, with the obvious intent of providing what we believe is vital information to others, as well as convince them of our viewpoint, whether that be in army building and tactics, or in a particular view of something WizKids is doing. Isn't that the whole point of customer feedback and providing a united front to WizKids against these changes?

In the end, what it comes down to is that while we all can post whatever we like, we are also all responsible for what we post. And right now what you, and many others, are posting is very negative towards the company, and thus have an effect of influencing others against the company, and against participation in general. I won't tell you to stop saying it, but I will call you on it when you do, particularly if you try claiming it is "for the good of the players", something I have heard condemned as a legitimate reason quite often of late.