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Have you played through the Subspace Emissary before?
Most of it (before I sent the Wii to my fiancee's place in Richmond). That's why I said "My experience with the game..." (and, as noted, apparently others as well as Bowser is not listed as one of the anti-Heroes forces when you peruse spoilers on it.)
Hey, I freely admit I'm not the friendliest character being I can win with either side...so long as Mario and Co. have been "bountied". Thing is, right now, if the two groups want to stop stalemating they need to "buy" me (and right now the Mafia's got the advantage in that they have to remove Mario at some point so unless the Town wants to lynch Mario, I don't have a reason to help the Town out of the Mexican Standoff.)
I -might- be persuaded to go after the other Neutral - Sonic - just to shake up numbers but that doesn't help me too much (as I definitely don't believe Darq would ever use his NK on Mario...sorry, if you want me to help you, you pay up front.)
"Nobody important? That's amazing. You know, in 900 years of traveling time and space I've never met someone who wasn't important."
Quote : Originally Posted by Ricosan95
Quote : Originally Posted by Originally posted by Rokk_Krinn
Alright, from my relatively expansive knowledge of the game (having beaten it three times) supplemented by the Smash Bros. Wiki website:
Bowser was working entirely against the good guys. In fact, he was the right hand man to Ganondorf, who came up mafia. Bowser, throughout the game, is constantly using the shadow gun to turn good guys into miniature trophies as part of the evil plan to take over the land.
Sonic, however, is not playable throughout the Subspace Emissary game. He is, however, seen in a cutscene at the very end of the game right before you fight Tabuu. He attacks Tabuu, setting you up for an easier battle with Tabuu.
Bowser is never truly good. In fact, the only reason he doesn't tear everyone a new one at the end of the game is because he understands the immediate threat in Tabuu. He isn't actually on the side of good, he simply doesn't want to die.
Keep in mind he starts to practive self-preservation at the very, very last boss battle. I don't think that would constitute a neutral alignment. Ganondorf, someone shown to have a mafia alignment, actually helped the heroes out at the end of the game by pointing them in the direction of Tabuu's realm.
Bowser is purely evil in this game, and I fail to see how he could be construed as neutral. Maybe I'm missing something about Sonic, but he would seem to be good to me, from his actions evident in the game. Bowser, however, showed consistent evil and cruelty throughout the game.
Your claim that Bowser is neutral, or could be easily considered neutral, is simply was too difficult to believe based on the game (which, in turn, this mafia game is based off of).
Bowser is never truly good. In fact, the only reason he doesn't tear everyone a new one at the end of the game is because he understands the immediate threat in Tabuu. He isn't actually on the side of good, he simply doesn't want to die.
I think though that you pretty much sum up what I've been saying right there. Ganondorf actually -wanted- to take over things...Bowser was just choosing a side that would enable him to "survive and benefit". That's what I've been trying to tell you guys - I'll go with whichever side enables me to do that (and my powers are also based entirely around that as we've seen).
"Nobody important? That's amazing. You know, in 900 years of traveling time and space I've never met someone who wasn't important."
Quote : Originally Posted by Ricosan95
Quote : Originally Posted by Originally posted by Rokk_Krinn
Something to think of here Darkseid - I had no reason to come forward with this much information about my role. I was not - frankly - in any danger. The only reason is to try and broker a deal (as I do prefer to win with the Town in games...I get tired of being thought of as Evil. ). Otherwise I could just sit back and not tell you anything as, well, you guys present no threat to me.
"Nobody important? That's amazing. You know, in 900 years of traveling time and space I've never met someone who wasn't important."
Quote : Originally Posted by Ricosan95
Quote : Originally Posted by Originally posted by Rokk_Krinn
I think though that you pretty much sum up what I've been saying right there. Ganondorf actually -wanted- to take over things...Bowser was just choosing a side that would enable him to "survive and benefit". That's what I've been trying to tell you guys - I'll go with whichever side enables me to do that (and my powers are also based entirely around that as we've seen).
From the Smash Bros Wiki:
Tabuu, the main villain of “The Subspace Emissary," wants to cut the world the main characters in Super Smash Bros. Brawl live in to pieces and drag it into his world. He hides himself in Subspace, watching their world vigilantly. Tabuu himself cannot leave Subspace. That’s why he has to prepare an army and a leader for the offensive into the other world. Tabuu studied Master Hand and the fighters, and this knowledge leads him to use Master Hand for his plans here. Chains of light bend Master Hand to the will of Tabuu, who uses Master Hand to enlist the likes of Ganondorf, Bowser, and Wario.
Ganondorf and Bowser were both evil. Nothing in the game or in the cold, hard facts about the game support the fact that Bowser was acting in some self-preservation mode. He quite simply was recruited to do evil and evil he did do.
I'll try and lay out how I see the game going, if you DON'T lynch DocDoom:
Tonight, I kill DocDoom. That's down to 6 players. 4 people needed for a lynch. If silencer is still in the game, we'll stall again.
I may survive, I may not. DocDoom may take me out as well.
If I survive:
Following night, I kill kontrol. 5 players, 3 needed for a lynch. That being said, I think it's quite possible the game ends there. You lose.
If I die:
The day after I kill Doc and die, 5 players needed. kontrol is still alive. No Town night kills, the game goes on until kontrol kills Mario. Olimar will protect Mario every night. If Mafia kills Olimar first, down to 4 players. According to you, that's 1 mafia, 1 Neutral (You), Mario and Sonic. If Mafia kill Mario, that leaves:
1 mafia, Sonic, and You (who have already reached your win condition). You control the vote.
Why should Mafia trust you to go along with them in the vote, if you've already won?
Of course, if you lynch DocDoom, you can ask me to kill Mario tonight. Even if I die at kontrol's hands, I kill Mario, getting you to the four person conundrum of kontrol, You, Olimar, Sonic. You've already won your win condition (if you are telling the truth). There would be no reason for you not to vote for the remaining two.
Of course, I could be lying about killing Mario for you.
Plus, I may have my numbers off, and there could be You + 2 other Scum.
"Why would the possibility of me being wrong ever stop me from doing something?"
Sorry, Darq. I've already said it - I've no reason to believe you would kill Mario and every reason to believe you wouldn't do that. You're just trying to set me up for a loss. If you'd lynched Mario, I would have backed you guys fully but instead you offer me nothing.
At least the Mafia knows I'll play with them if they're getting close to a win (as Mario will go bye-bye at some point in all of this) and thus I can have my Bounty condition.
I'd prefer the Town win - for reasons already stated - but if the Town isn't willing to broker that, I'll sit back and wait for the stallout to happen again and again.
"Nobody important? That's amazing. You know, in 900 years of traveling time and space I've never met someone who wasn't important."
Quote : Originally Posted by Ricosan95
Quote : Originally Posted by Originally posted by Rokk_Krinn
One of them is silenced, and I strongly suspect that it is vicious. Which, by extension, and supposing DocDoom is mafia, would mean that kontrol is scummmy scum from the land of scum.
We need a lynch, or the game will stall. Rokk is playing his bounty game to avoid actually voting. It's a plot to allow himself the pleasure of not having to truly explain his not voting, and it's getting really old.
He's spewing a lot of smoke and mirrors about his character and Bowser's possible alignment, and I don't buy any of it. The more we fail to lynch someone, the higher the chances Rokk and his crew are going to successfully kill someone.
Also, DocDoom hasn't posted, although I just don't feel him being silenced. I might be wrong (it's happened before ) but I'm leaning towards vicious being silenced over Doc.
A large fighter stood, and a large fist crashed into him. The fighter flew through the air, and landed unceremoniously on the ground. Before he could retreat into his spiked shell, the fist pounded him into the ground, and crushed the air from his lungs. The hand then picked him up, and threw the fighter far into the distance.
Rokk_Krinn has left the game!!! He was Bowser (Mafia/Mushroom Kingdom) giant Koopa King!
Hmph. Interesting. Nice try on the Bounty Hunter claim Rokk, you actually had started to convince me a little. It why he's the best.
I once again failed to kill DocDoom... which I can't understand why. He was being bodyguarded by Raiser, so he obviously can be NightKilled. Was I blocked? Jailkept?
With one player silenced, I see this day going one of four ways:
1) Another Stall
2) Mafia tries to convince us to take out Crazy Hand
3) Crazy Hand tries to convince us to take out Mafia
4) Mario and I are the lone Town left, and Mafia + Crazy Hand try to convince "Sonic" and "Olimar" to vote out one of us.
Both 2 and 3 are possible. I can't see 4 happening. And 1 is most likely.
For now, I will
Lynch: DocDoom
Unless Doc would like to try and make a deal.
"Why would the possibility of me being wrong ever stop me from doing something?"