This may be an age-old question, that the true answer has eluded my fellow gamers and i possibly, but....

if vet FF Dr. Strange copies the FF TA from Invisible Girl and gets his 19, can he still use ESD on top of that for a 21 at range? what brought this up is the idea of not modifying replacement values...and ESD reads "modify the defense value by +2". help please, thx....

Nothing says you can't modify replacement values. Instead, the problem that usually confounds people is the timing of the modifiers. Modifiers that occur before the replacement are also replaced. This is why if you Perplex up your character's damage, but then roll BCF, the Perplex is wasted. If, instead, the modifier occurs after the replacement or at the same time, it will modify the replacement value.

An easy way to think of this (though not technically correct) is that ES/D is always 'on'. It adds +2 to DV before the replacement value, during the replacement, and after the replacement has come and gone. ES/D doesn't care what number it is modifying.

Does this help?

Same with Combat Reflexes.

Lets put it THIS way. If Jakeem Thunder Defends for R SN Kang, Kang's rockin' a 20 from range. 18 Defended + 2 ESD.

so, if you oracle up your defense value by 1, and it is replaced by a 19, it will become 20, right? thx much. i don't know where i heard that you cannot modify replacement values...

i suppose i should have worded it: replace to a 19, then oracle to 20.

I'm pretty sure that is not correct. ICWO takes effect immediately on whatever defense you currently have. It is then overwritten by the replacement value. In the case of ESD or CR, they do not occur until the attack, so by then the value has already been replaced, and they are further added on top of it.

No. The +1 from Oracle occurs before the replacement (timing wise, you increase the combat value when you first give the character an action, but before you actually execute said action). Because of this, the +1 from Oracle is replaced by the new DV, AV, damage value, etc.

a tad confusing, but i think i got it. thanx. bottom line, ESD and CR work with replaced values, ICWO does not.

The thing is, there are a lot more things that work and don't work with replacement values than just those three examples. Simply listing them all, besides taking a lot of time, doesn't really teach anyone what to look for when determining if a new power/feat/BFC/etc combo works.

As I said in the first post, it all has to do with the timing.

Does the modifier occur before or after/at the same time as the replacement value?

Before = replacement value totally replaces old value, including any modifiers.

After/at the same time = replacement value is modified.

Is this a little more clear?

yes it is, thank you.

Does the rule or three then apply to the replacement value?

Correct. You couldn't get Doctor Strange's defense higher than a 22. He could get the 19 from Sue Storm, add on his ESD, and then be sitting in hindering terrain. Anything over that gets canceled out by the rule of 3.

Can i assume then that would apply to 2 sinister syndicate team members. If one has his attack replaced up to an 11 by taskmaster. Can he then add up to three more onto that if he has 3 Hydra team members adjacent to him with a clear line of site to the same target?

The rule of 3 only applies to modifiers - replacement values are treated as a new "baseline" value and can be furhter modified as appropriate. The scenario you outline is legal (but somewhat tricky to pull off...)

Can someone remind me how the following works:

Two adjacent teammates, both Sinister Syndicate. The first uses Perplex/ICWO to increase Attack Value and the second wishes to share the first's AV..."replace than modify" means that the shared attack value is the unmodified one?

On Defense, LE Sue Storm uses ICWO to increase her defense value. IIRC from the errata/clarifications any figure using the (alt)-F4 TA can only use her unmodified Defense value?