this just came across my mind. Now (or should I say soon) perplex is for a whole turn lets say they someone perplexes your damage down or whatever and then on your turn you outsiders the target that was perplexed do their combat values return to normal or can they just not be further changed?


Thanks hope it makes sense

Far as I know abilities like that state that they can not be higher than their printed value so what your saying should not help.

Also The way that Perplex is Now was how I played it in the begining and How I thought it should have always been. So thumbs up for that change.

Outsiders prevents a stat from being the target of any modifications, but since the change (via Perplex) was already in place I would expect that Outsiders wouldn't interfere. You just wouldn't be able to change any of the combat values on that piece for the turn. You would, however, prevent your oppoent from pulling the same trick again next turn on that piece, since Outsiders would protect it until the beginning of your next turn.

You'd just have to remember to do it at the beginning of your turn.

If I'm missing/misinterpreting something, anyone, speak up.

Outsiders TA.....

Once at the beginning of your turn as a free action, a member of this team chooses a target friendly or opposing character within 10 squares; the member must have clear line of fire to the target. Until the beginning of your next turn, the target may not be the target of powers or team abilities that modify its combat values. This team ability may not be copied by wild card team abilities.

If your figures values were perplexed down, and you state at the beginning of your turn that you're targeting your character with the Outsiders TA, the values would go back their printed value and you in turn could not modify them yourself either.

While this is somewhat new territory, that's how I'd rule it. Heck, you might even start seeing Outsiders (besides Chief) on teams now to beef up 'offensive Perplex'.

Yeah, nvm, i think you're right. it says "Until the beginning of your next turn" so previous modifications would still be in effect i would guess.

I was just about to say something, but you caught it yourself. Still, a ruling might be made contrary to 'popular opinion'. I could see it going both ways, but i'd rule it the 'modification locked in' way.

I can guarantee the official ruling will be against popular opinion.

The way Perplex will work when Fantastic Four comes out works in the same way that Outwit works. The effect normally lasts until the beginning of your next turn. In the case of Outwit, if you counter a power then Rip Hunter becomes adjacent to the countered character, the countered power returns because being targeted by Outwit is a continual effect which means it's always checking for its current target, not just during the action Outwit is used.

Going by that precedence, being targeted by Perplex and the modification of the combat values is a continual effect which, again, means it's always checking for its target. So if you Perplex a character's value then it's targeted by Outsiders in the following turn, the target is checked when Outsiders hits and the modification from Perplex would go away.

While I don't agree that your analogy holds (and the idea that Outwit is "always checking for its current target"), it just goes to show that we often need official rulings on new combinations.

The constant checking thing is probably how this will be ruled, I agree.

But let me chime in and say how stupid the 'check' concept is, because LOS is a requirement that's constantly broken during perplex/outwit effects...

I'm with Speedster here.
Does Outsiders prevent an ability from being modified?
Does perplex modify an ability?

It doesn't matter when it was modified, once targeted by the Outsiders, it can't be modified.

Even if it's already modified..? Hurm. Well, I'm getting a better sense of why some people are ready to just crumple the rulebook and go play Alpha.

Either way, it's one for Norm to field, I suppose.

Speedster is correct. Nbperp answered it, though with a slightly different case:

(from this thread, first post)

constantly check if you're outwitted? what? so you're saying if i move out of LOS (or is it LOF) that i get my outwitted powers back? wrong.