my group of friends have always played that when a power reads someone "may use x and y" that it meant both, but if it says they "can use x or y" that it meant one "or" the other. one of our group of friends recently said that "or use" means the same as "and use," and he posted a link to a thread where some responders said yes, others no, and the question was edited partway through, meaning i have no idea what the actual ruling was lol now i would love for figures with "perplex and outwit" to have no advantage over "perplex or outwit" but i dont see how a wording disparity like that gibes with some of the excrutiangly thought-out power wordings. i would love some kind of clarity on this!

Depends on the context of the rest of the power, but in general, "and" indicates all powers can be used (in theory) and "or" indicates that a choice must be made.

Now this doesn't mean a character that "can use Hypersonic Speed and Phasing/Teleport" can use them both at the same time; both of those powers are activated by power actions and thus can't be used with the same action.

thats what i've been saying. with power actions we've gotten that straightened out (finally!) but its multiple free actions per turn with "or" that we're still debating...

For example?

MULTIPLE PERSONALITIES: Moon Knight can use Close Combat Expert, Perplex (targeting only himself), or Ranged Combat Expert. After resolving an action in which he uses one of these powers, deal Moon Knight 1 unavoidable damage.

3rd question is what he is referring to in this thread.

http://www.hcrealms.com/forum/showthread.php?t=294785

This one is an outlier from the first set that featured special powers. New game effect growing-pains, if you will.

True, a new player to the game has no reason to really know that this is an exception, but that's what it is. Nothing specifically prevents Moonknight from using, say, CCE (a power action) and then Perplex (a free action) provided you were willing to take the damage.



In every other case I can think of, though, "and" means "any/all of these powers" and "or" means "pick one and go with it".

Amen.

Satisfied, Rob?

Although most (if not every) instance of "or" says something like "Once during your turn" (see The Question) or "Once per turn" (See Metron) which should reduce the confusion.

Everyone except Moon Knight uses the "once per" language.

Assume a figure is released in DC 75 which says "Apache Chief can use Outwit or Perplex."

He could use them both in the same turn.

ok guys...i guess the answer is do my homework once i tried to think of a specific case, i realized i couldn't... but, hypothetically, does "or" indicate a choice like normalview says, or mean nothing as harupa says? if it doesnt exist within the game, cool, but when i see "or" i see a limiting choice, not an open-ended one. but thats just me. thanks!

There is no hard and fast rule, as I indicated above. Now, most any example of "or" will come with some other indication on how/what it can be used, but if there is no such context to base your reading on (like Moon Knight's) then there is no functional difference.

Moon Knight is an odd-ball, though, and "or" is typically used to indicate some kind of choice... but you need to read the entire power to figure out what and how the choice is made.

Sorry to drag this out further but this has turned into a debate and apparently I need a second orange to agree.

Using Harpua's example. If a figure says "Apache Chief can use Outwit or Perplex" could he in fact use both

Yes. He could use both in the same turn, unless the wording of the power was: "Once per turn, Apache Chief can use Outwit or Perplex."

For someone like Question or Big Figure (I think) they can use either perplex or outwit once per turn (meaning they have to make a choice), because the power specifically states: once per turn.

We are all in agreement about the Once per turn aspects of this. It's just that in an example as stated.