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In competitive games, not friendly games question...
After the beginning of the game, or after my opponents first turn where he/she announces it as my turn - is it my turn and nothing else can happen on my opponents turn? i.e. Roll for gauntlet/Utility Belt, announce Cypher's copy team ability, etc. or can any mistake still be rectified? If I roll for leadership then I assume it is to late because dice have moved. IF one of my players come to me with this as in issue how do I rule? I would typically say if you removed tokens and ended your turn to your opponent, no other actions/selections/items can be taken. Even forgotten required ones. Am I wrong or correct?
After the beginning of the game, or after my opponents first turn where he/she announces it as my turn - is it my turn and nothing else can happen on my opponents turn? i.e. Roll for gauntlet/Utility Belt, announce Cypher's copy team ability, etc. or can any mistake still be rectified? If I roll for leadership then I assume it is to late because dice have moved. IF one of my players come to me with this as in issue how do I rule? I would typically say if you removed tokens and ended your turn to your opponent, no other actions/selections/items can be taken. Even forgotten required ones. Am I wrong or correct?
Once a player has declared their turn is over (typically by clearing action tokens), then the turn is over.
If you want to let your opponent do a quick, "Oh, I forgot..." before you actually do anything, that is your call. If you don't want to let him do that, that is also your call.
If someone said "you forgot to roll for the gauntlet, take a damage" I would tell that player that if he forgot one thing, then he forgot all of it.
Even in tournament set, if something is forgotten and there is time to rectify it before to much else happens, then it is sportsmen like to allow them to correct it. This meaning things that are supposed to happen.
Quote : Originally Posted by Necromagus
When I came on board as RA I brought with me a mission to meet the intent of a power/ability and a firm distaste for exploits or loopholes that circumvented the intention of a rule. That's where the Rules team comes in.
If someone said "you forgot to roll for the gauntlet, take a damage" I would tell that player that if he forgot one thing, then he forgot all of it.
Even in tournament set, if something is forgotten and there is time to rectify it before to much else happens, then it is sportsmen like to allow them to correct it. This meaning things that are supposed to happen.
If you knowingly let your opponent forget a non-optional thing, then you are cheating.
If you are 'silly' enough to say something that proves you knew that he or she was forgetting, then you can be disqualified for cheating.
After the beginning of the game, or after my opponents first turn where he/she announces it as my turn - is it my turn and nothing else can happen on my opponents turn? i.e. Roll for gauntlet/Utility Belt, announce Cypher's copy team ability, etc. or can any mistake still be rectified? If I roll for leadership then I assume it is to late because dice have moved. IF one of my players come to me with this as in issue how do I rule? I would typically say if you removed tokens and ended your turn to your opponent, no other actions/selections/items can be taken. Even forgotten required ones. Am I wrong or correct?
Stuff that occurs during the end of the turn, that isn't activated by a free action, can still happen even after action tokens are cleared. So, as long as you haven't done anything yourself, you still have time to demand your opponent roll for the gauntlet or do other non-optional things that happen during the end of their turn.
Stuff that occurs during the end of the turn, that isn't activated by a free action, can still happen even after action tokens are cleared. So, as long as you haven't done anything yourself, you still have time to demand your opponent roll for the gauntlet or do other non-optional things that happen during the end of their turn.
I tend to go this way with say a resource roll or a map roll if required by map, because there is the part that the turn is over, but before the opponents turn begins. Really rolling a resource is not the best example. Maybe the Super Skrull that can announce Stealth or ESD at end of turn is a better example. If you have cleared tokens, and announced it is your opponents turn, then you cannot claim that SP defense or say oh and I perplex up The Mighty George's Defense by 3 with Triple Perplex Girl. In a tournament, I would rule the turn was over. I will say that if you do forget to roll for map or gauntlet or any kind of non optional, before any action is taken, that needs to be done, even if the turn has been passed to the opponent. If a free action or non action has been declared or taken, too late. Thanks for the responses.
Oops, I forgot to roll off my +2/Flurry. Oops, you, me or both of us forgot to click Gamma bomb. Oops, we missed our Earthquake roll.
Non-optional events should be forced if caught within a turn cycle for better or worse. Players really shouldn't have to play both sides of the table and shady actions shouldn't be something to benefit from. At least that's how I'd run events.
Oops, I forgot to roll off my +2/Flurry. Oops, you, me or both of us forgot to click Gamma bomb. Oops, we missed our Earthquake roll.
Non-optional events should be forced if caught within a turn cycle for better or worse. Players really shouldn't have to play both sides of the table and shady actions shouldn't be something to benefit from. At least that's how I'd run events.
And, if mid-cycle, the Gamma Bomb goes off KO-ing characters that were in the middle of doing whatever when you remembered, what then? Or would you let them rewind/replay that, too? And if so, where do you stop? Why not go back and redo some other things, too?
For better or for worse, misplays happen. And the only thing you can really do that is A) fair for both players and B) doesn't create an absolute nightmare of take-backs, do-overs, and other such things is to simply keep playing and try to do better next time.
And, if mid-cycle, the Gamma Bomb goes off KO-ing characters that were in the middle of doing whatever when you remembered, what then? Or would you let them rewind/replay that, too? And if so, where do you stop? Why not go back and redo some other things, too?
For better or for worse, misplays happen. And the only thing you can really do that is A) fair for both players and B) doesn't create an absolute nightmare of take-backs, do-overs, and other such things is to simply keep playing and try to do better next time.
It's unfair either way. The Gamma Bomb may have just damaged/killed someone that it may not have otherwise but then again I was just able to keep +2/Flurry which can be as broken if not worse than the Gamma Bomb.
Are there any official rules for situations like this? If not, then I will just apply my Magic: The Gathering equivalent tournament rules knowledge which is what I said earlier. Yes, it may create some odd situations but players will probably be more vigilante in the future because of it.
It's unfair either way. The Gamma Bomb may have just damaged/killed someone that it may not have otherwise but then again I was just able to keep +2/Flurry which can be as broken if not worse than the Gamma Bomb.
And why didn't *YOU* remind your opponent to roll for the UB? You should be watching for required stuff, too. If you let your opponent forget to roll for his UB, then tough luck sir.
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Are there any official rules for situations like this?
Yes. Misplays happen. Deal with it and move on, like I said above.
And why didn't *YOU* remind your opponent to roll for the UB? You should be watching for required stuff, too. If you let your opponent forget to roll for his UB, then tough luck sir.
Yes. Misplays happen. Deal with it and move on, like I said above.
I'm really not trying to start a fight but I didn't notice anything about handling missed actions in the Comprehensive Tournament Rules. Did I miss it or is it in a different document?
I'm also having a hard time with the Bye rule in the current Comp. Rules. I don't like the idea of penalizing a player for having randomly been chosen for the bye when it comes to potential tie breakers. But that's officially written there so that's how it shall be played.
I'm really not trying to start a fight but I didn't notice anything about handling missed actions in the Comprehensive Tournament Rules. Did I miss it or is it in a different document?
You didn't miss it. This is because nowhere does it tell you wind back the clock, take back moves, or otherwise do anything but play the game.
When in doubt, call for a judge. If they make a determination that something should be done, that is there call. But in general, the state of play is not altered or "fixed".
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I'm also having a hard time with the Bye rule in the current Comp. Rules. I don't like the idea of penalizing a player for having randomly been chosen for the bye when it comes to potential tie breakers. But that's officially written there so that's how it shall be played.
This is why, in official tournaments, you play until there is one undefeated player. In that kind of a set-up, a bye is not a penalty (a win is a win). Of course, if you don't play that way, either because of time constraints or you just don't feel like doing it that way, that's your business and can run it how you wish.
This is why, in official tournaments, you play until there is one undefeated player. In that kind of a set-up, a bye is not a penalty (a win is a win). Of course, if you don't play that way, either because of time constraints or you just don't feel like doing it that way, that's your business and can run it how you wish.
Gotcha. So this more applies for events that have a playoff. We usually just do 3 rounds with the first place, second place, and a random 3rd prize is awarded (players secretly cast up to two votes for any of their tournament opponents and then a name is drawn out of a "hat").